A Contagious Smile Podcast
A Contagious Smile is a powerful platform dedicated to uplifting and empowering special needs families and survivors of domestic violence. Through heartfelt stories, we shine a light on the journeys of extraordinary individuals who have overcome unimaginable challenges. Their triumphs serve as a testament to resilience and strength, inspiring others to rediscover their own inner light. Each episode features candid interviews with survivors, advocates, and experts who provide valuable resources and insights to support those on their own paths to healing and empowerment. Join us as we celebrate the power of resilience, the beauty of shared stories, and the unstoppable spirit of those who turn adversity into hope. Let us guide you in rekindling your spirit, because every smile tells a story of courage and transformation.
A Contagious Smile Podcast
Narc Narc, Who's There, Help, I'm Gasping For Air. Trigger Warning Reclaiming Joy: Navigating Toxic Family Dynamics, Honoring Mental Health, and Embracing Chosen Family
Trigger Warning. Picture this: it's the holiday season, but instead of joy, you're bracing yourself for another round of toxic family gatherings. Do you stand your ground and prioritize your mental health? Today, we share stories of those who courageously chose self-respect over harmful traditions, setting boundaries with family members who drained their energy. These empowering narratives remind us that family isn't just about blood relations, but about meaningful choices. We shine a light on the bravery it takes to reclaim one's voice and the profound personal growth that follows.
Our episode peels back the layers of complex family dynamics and the emotional toll of feeling unappreciated. We explore how generational trauma often manifests in families, where personal pain is dismissed or trivialized, and how narcissistic systems perpetuate cycles of blame. Through candid discussions about mental health, including the distinctions between circumstantial and clinical depression, we address the importance of honoring individual struggles without comparison. Personal stories bring clarity on how controlling relationships can be challenged, offering hope to those who feel overshadowed by narcissistic family members.
Lastly, we delve into the transformative power of chosen family and community support. There's an undeniable strength in surrounding oneself with those who uplift and understand, especially when facing the heartache of being the family 'black sheep.' We discuss the relief found in unveiling personal truths and standing firm against external pressures. This episode is a testament to the resilience of the human spirit, emphasizing the importance of finding solidarity and empowerment through supportive relationships, proving that you're never alone on this journey of healing and self-discovery.
Good evening and welcome to another episode of Narg. Narg, who's there? Help, I'm gasping for air. We are back. Happy belated Thanksgiving. I hope you had a good, quiet one. We've already. We've been talking for a while before we got on here. I nitpicked through and got some of these stories that I thought would be great way to show and do this episode, because some of them are heart wrenching and some of them you just want to be like yes, yes, good for you, you were awesome. So again, my ride or die. My, my girl, my non-biological twin, is with us. Thank you so much. As always. I wish she would announce that this was her show too, but we're working on it. Are you ready just to rip the bandaid?
Speaker 2:off and get going. That is what I do. I love ripping band-aids off. Let's just get to it.
Speaker 1:So I had someone write last night and I thought this was great. I'm going to put this in here. I had someone write last night and I thought this is great. I'm going to put this in here. This is our holiday tradition they insisted on, continually and painfully continue the family traditions. I stood firm and stated that this tradition hurts me and I no longer want to participate. My healing matters more than your low life, self-centered piece of shit personality. Their disbelief only strengthened my resolve and I decided to stay home for the first time ever.
Speaker 2:Well, whoever wrote that, congratulations, Welcome to cutting off your family and finding peace in your life. I think the first time you say no, the first time you say set that boundary is the first time you finally say yes to yourself. So that is huge, because so many of us have been there and have either been shamed by other people for it, because that's your blood and you shouldn't do that, and they try to make you feel guilty, as if it you are the reason that the family has this discord. Um, and, and that's not the case, and and I still go back to, if you know, it doesn't matter whether you're blood related or not your family's, who you decide.
Speaker 2:It is, as you always say, victoria, but it really is the truth. Do we want our mothers and fathers and siblings and aunts, uncles, cousins and whoever else to love us and for us all to get along in an ideal world? Yes, that would be amazing, but that is not the case, and I think that none of us should have to sacrifice our self-respect, especially to people that have none for us. So good for you. All I can say, too, is if you are feeling a little, you know a certain way about it, because we all usually do, for sometimes years and sometimes decades, it goes away. It gets better. There's definitely things you can do, you know, and you'll probably see both of us post stuff online during the holidays, but it gets better.
Speaker 1:It does. And you know what. Take all those stones and bricks they throw at you. Build a wall, you know, get behind the wall and don't let them in, don't let them over it. And you know that's amazing, that you stood by your feelings and you stood up to them. And you know what, even though you might have a little bit oh my God, what did I just do? For a minute, I guarantee you felt like damn. That felt good, like that. That. That was so fulfilling for myself because I finally did what I need to do and I deserve it. So take that win. A hundred percent, absolutely All right.
Speaker 1:I confronted my narcissistic father unexpectedly during an evening where he decided to make me feel horrible about everything going on in his job. I get that. I said to him you made me feel less than worthy of life for far too long. I am going to reclaim my voice. The words have no power over me anymore. To me, you're now someone with nothing more than laryngitis. I like it. His shock was stunning and yet, for the first time ever, I felt empowered.
Speaker 2:That's amazing too. I mean, I love that we're hearing from people that are finally putting themselves first and taking a stand, because you know, I had a deep conversation with somebody months ago about well, yeah, but if you do something like that, to what extent are you being selfish versus honoring your self-respect? And I just said, yeah, but at what point are you going to stop letting people walk all over you and treat you like crap? That's the definitive moment. So good for you, whoever. That was as well, I believe meoria and I know about narcissistic fathers and you know they don't get to scapegoat you not unless you allow them to. So, yay, and I love these wins.
Speaker 1:Yay, yep, you asked for them um weeks ago and they're pouring in weeks ago and they're pouring in. So, all right, I like this one, the letter. I wrote them a letter detailing the pain that they had caused me over the course of my life. I'm trying to go into my master's program and I can't focus into my studies when I'm constantly being belittled left, right and center. I had moved home in order to try to save, as going through a master's program is quite expensive. I get that too so I decided to write them a letter and it said I hope you actually read this and take the time out of your schedule to just hear what I'm trying to say. Since you won't let me use my voice, I'm going to use my penmanship.
Speaker 1:So I want you to understand that you have caused so much hurt and so much pain, and it's been all of what you have inflicted onto my life. You are the parents and even though I am an adult and I am over the age of 21, it is still your responsibility to show me how you're supposed to act as an adult, a parent, as an adult. However, you chose never to do that and blame me for everything. You blamed me for the kitchen faucet breaking. You blamed me for the flood in the basement. All of these things are my fault, and I'm not even around when this happens. How could I flood a basement? I mean, let's be real here just for a moment.
Speaker 1:The problem is is that whenever I try to say I wasn't even here, you don't even listen and you already know it. Yet you turn around and tell everybody that I did these horrific things in the house and that you have to pay for it because I'm worthless. I am reclaiming my life. I want you to know I will no longer be your victim. The silence that you have provided for me is deafening. And guess what I'm done? Here's my notice I'm moving out and I will no longer be your escape goat or paying you rent. I'm out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, peace out, I like to say, because you do get peace when you get the hell out. I'm not trying to make fun, but the only thing I'm going to say because bravo, bravo to whoever wrote that as well. I love people that are finally having the courage to take a stand for themselves. The only issue is that the reason that we are silenced by narcissists is because, one, they don't care. Two, they're never going to take responsibility. Because it's not them. They will always scapegoat you. It is always going to be your fault if you are the person they want to pin everything on. So that letter, I think, as long as you're aware that you wrote that more for you and for yourself, which I am.
Speaker 2:I'm a writer, you know. I firmly believe in and I've written a lot of letters to people and I live out in the country. So I will even go outside and like blast some certain song, that like an F? You song, and burn that mother trucker and I just if I'm feeling a certain way, man, I just take it. You know it makes me feel good, but I think that's the thing you have to recognize when you decide to write these letters. I've never given anyone the letters, not because of some cowardice or anything. It's just that I know it would be a waste of time and effort and energy, because if they even read it, they wouldn't care what I said. It would be chalked up to. She's difficult, she's emotional, she's crazy, she's whatever. So I save it for me, I do it for me. But yay, I love that. I love the taking. This is amazing, yeah.
Speaker 1:This is great. I have to tell you, I and I I'm very curious of what one of your songs is. One of mine is I hate everything about you, by ugly kid Joe.
Speaker 1:And I used to play it and use mommy words by playing it and I would go around and you know I hate everything about you and faith would run out and go. Maybe I hate everything about you, which is what she called grandma because she said it was all about her. So it's me, me, me, me, me. So, oh, my god calls her mimi, or faith called her mimi when they spoke. So I'd be blaring the song and I would not tell her you know why I was playing it and she would just run out from whatever she why I was playing it and she would just run out from whatever she was doing and she'd be like I hate everything about. Maybe it was just like perfect.
Speaker 1:So, but yeah, what? What is your yell out loud?
Speaker 2:So it's, I don't have a certain one. So if you remember my first book gasping for air, like in that preface, I kind of explained why every chapter is actually a song title. Because as a little girl being raised by two narcissistic parents who physically and verbally abused me and scapegoated the crap out of me, I learned that I could not speak up, I could not stand my ground, I couldn't stand up for myself. So I started kind of applying songs because of their lyrics or their melody or whatever, to certain people or situations. So it just depends, like, what my letter says and who it's to Like.
Speaker 2:There's just some song that in my mental database that applies to that perfectly, applies to that perfectly. You know, like the last time I burned a letter it was actually a letter to my ex um. That was over this summer and I played it's one of my favorite songs ever, but, um, it's called Breakdown More by Eric Hutchinson. So it's not so much of an F you as it is. Uh, you know, just saying what I have to say. But yeah, I just feel like sometimes songs can say stuff so much better than we can. But I still write my letters because and I take pictures of them and put them in a Google Drive. I'm a weirdo like that because, just in case I want to revisit that situation or I need to like tear it up or you know, print it out and burn it again for my peace of mind.
Speaker 2:Yeah, why not?
Speaker 1:I see nothing wrong with that, all right. So at a family gathering, my aunt brought up her struggles with anxiety in front of everyone, talking about how just consuming it was of herself the fact that she suffered with such anxiety. Everybody there reached over to her with sympathy and hugs and devotion and understanding. Yet when people look over at me and my narcissistic dad and narcissistic mom tell everybody that I have anxiety and depression, people say it's all in my head and that's not a real thing.
Speaker 1:I stood there at the gathering, dumbfounded, watching everybody boohoo and hug all over my aunt, who never has any anxiety about anything more than what to wear. Okay, we all have problems, but you're the only one who can't seem to handle it, my aunt said after announcing she now suffers from anxiety. She actually had the audacity to yell at me that we all have problems and I'm the only one who can't seem to handle it. Laughter erupted from everyone else and I sat frozen, my face burned in shame and I felt like a pariah, as if my pain was a joke. That moment I reinforced my belief and I literally stood up and took everything off the table, threw it on the floor, told them to go screw themselves and walked out the door.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that sounds like something I've done in the past. I have, uh, I have stormed out of a few places a few times in my life for the same reason. And you know, it's interesting because when we get angry like that, that angry that we storm out, I mean that is something that is the embers of our self-respect standing up for us because we've tolerated too much crap. So, yeah, I mean I've been there, I feel you on that, I, I, I get it and I think that I'm a believer and you have to cut that toxicity out, because people are not going to change, especially people that have that much. Um, I mean, to say they're apathetic is an understatement, but you know that you're not going to find your people. It sounds like in that group and if your aunt talk about that, that sounds like a narcissist. Oh, my God, she's something else to think that her anxiety trumps all other people's like. You know, we were just we. We've had conversations about that.
Speaker 2:People compare dramas all the time. I often hear from people you've probably heard it a million times oh, you know, what I've been through isn't as bad as yours, or I've been through worse than you. That was what my mother used to use on me was oh well, you didn't have it, you don't have it as bad as I did, and it's like oh, so we're just going to invalidate the fact that your husband does all these things and that you do all these things to me because you had it worse. I mean talk about perpetuating generational trauma, jesus Christ. But yeah, absolutely, you know.
Speaker 1:I say I say it all the time I don't care if it's one kick, one punch, one hit, it's one too many and it's not a comparison, it's not a competition. And if you've been hit or disrespected or had their hands on you in an unwarranted manner, it's not a competition. It is, you know, unacceptable. And what it is is. They're spinning it so that it's not on them, like you know. Oh well, he only hit you once. Well, he hit you 200 times. He hit you, whatever. Why is it now on us and not on the son of a bitch who did it? So no, it's not a competition at all.
Speaker 1:And the fact that this lunatic is like I have anxiety, you know. Did you just realize that? Did somebody cut you off at the red light? Because that, to you, is anxiety? It's not the same thing, you know. You're not living with these narcissistic pricks, so you don't have an idea. But here's my idea. Why don't you and your narcissistic pricks so you don't have an idea? But here's my idea why don't you and your narcissistic sister or brother-in-law, whoever it is go on a little tiny cruise and a little rowboat and shove the oar right in your ass? That's all I got. Like, I'm just sorry, but I mean seriously. Like people are like oh, I'm depressed. There's a difference between depression and being depressed and so many people today hang on the I'm depressed. You know, yes, when you lose someone, people are depressed because they lost it, but it's not depression. You know, I lost a loved one. I'm depressed. I've lost someone that I love.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Circumstantial Right yeah, circumstantial versus clinical Right.
Speaker 1:But absolutely yeah, and they make you anxious. Anxious that doesn't mean you have anxiety for crying out loud. That just means that your freaking head's in your ass. I mean, come on, you're gonna blame, you know, the people who live with this. And don't tell me that if this is the aunt, I'm speculating. If this is the aunt, then the brother or sister of this black sheep has to be the parent. So they grew up knowing. One of these two was you know the way that they are. So don't try and like sugarcoat it and the whole family going over and boohooing for the aunt. I mean, I'm the most sympathetic person ever and I feel bad, you know, when anything like that happens. But if you're gonna sit there and say, oh, I have anxiety now and this other person who has been just miserable and sad because they've been treated like crap and walked all over and put the blame on for things they didn't even do, is overlooked, I mean.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but that's a typical narcissistic family system and I think what we're missing here is that the aunt is obviously a covert narcissist, just like my ex-husband. They thrive on other people's pity. So whether they get a fricking paper cut, or if they had a bad day, or if it rained on their hairdo or whatever, it's poor me, poor me, and they thrive on other people's pity and family systems. I always say this they, like my mother, they enable, excuse and tolerate. So they have developed this dynamic that she cries about whatever it is and then everybody soothes her, you know, and maybe honestly, maybe they all want to shut her the hell up, so they give in to her. But whatever it is, it's definitely disrespectful when you actually validly have a reason and validly have some diagnosis or whatever, and somebody else is over there crying about it Like that just pisses me off. But I think that's all it is is. This is an ego situation.
Speaker 2:You got up and left. I would have done the same thing. I would have removed myself. I cannot sit there quietly and watch bullshit. But that's just me. But, um, yeah, I mean I. I think it was the right thing to do and just going forward.
Speaker 1:Just don't insert yourself into those situations, knowing how they operate right and I just want to put one in there that you know, I know that you're for a moment sitting there sitting back and wondering about your aunt and all that. But let me tell you, you know, I know that you're for a moment sitting there sitting back and wondering about your aunt and all that, but let me tell you, you know and I've never cried the whole feel bad for me what I've gone through. I'll come home from surgery and jump on a podcast and I work and I do all these other things and, and you know, most people like, hey, how was your day? No-transcript, here's my silver lining, right? So I can't tell you how many times my sperm donor would say, oh, it's just another day that ends in Y, she's back on the OR table. It's like I don't care if it's one surgery or 300, it's still serious. It's still, you know, a scary thing.
Speaker 1:And if he had, I'll never forget it he had his, he had his cavity filled and he was like you've never known as much pain as I'm in, like you couldn't fathom the pain that I'm in. And I remember looking at him and I was like what? And he and he goes. I'm in more pain than you can ever fathom, cause I had to get a cavity filled and faith, bless her heart, walks up and I mean I'll never forget it. She was like seven and seven and a half and she goes. Oh, we know how much pain this is. We're in this conversation and we're listening to you.
Speaker 2:And it was just that's faith. You know I know, I know, but I love that she gave it right back to him Right, yeah, I mean, it has no effect. They don't care what anyone says to them. They consider it, but it is a little funny when she does it, yeah.
Speaker 1:Because she holds nothing back. It's fun, all right For a birthday. I spent weeks crafting a heartfelt gift for my sister. I was hoping it would bridge the gap that we've had growing up between us, as I've always been the black sheep and she was the golden child. When she unwrapped it she rolled her eyes and said wow, do you really think this is good enough for me? I stood there feeling my chest crumble as she threw it in the trash. In that moment I realized that no effort that I ever could make would be enough or appreciated. I was always going to be the absolute disappointment in the family.
Speaker 2:That's tough. You know what I'm thinking about. I'm thinking about that chapter in Choking on Shame, a Little Bit of Soap where I was five years old and I literally saved up all my little pennies to buy little Christmas gifts for everybody at our little school. It was kind of a bizarre gift shop where you could buy stuff for like a nickel or a dime and I thought I was making amends and making my mother proud by getting something for the man she was going to marry and that Dick Watt opened that present and he's like what am I going to do with this? And just same thing, just threw it down, you know. And and all my mother did was weekly, you know, say his name, like come on, and he's like, what it's? What am I going to do with this? This is some cheap piece of crap.
Speaker 2:And I just remember crying because I'm like I, it meant so much coming from me and I just it's hard to feel unappreciated though in any part of our lives, but we have to, unfortunately, accept the fact that, just like we want things and and we have desires and things we want that other people might not have, uh, the same, you know, and and I I've I've said for a long time in my life.
Speaker 2:I learned it early on and it's such a horrible thing to come to terms with when you're young. But one of the worst things in life, I believe, is when you find out and it's usually not in a good way like this that you care about somebody more than they care about you. I mean, it's heart wrenching. It is my heart goes out to whoever wrote that in. But you know, here's what I will say. I love that. You honored yourself by doing something that was in your heart and had good intentions to do. The fact that it wasn't well received is unfortunate, but at least now you know where you stand and you know. Hopefully you can process that and heal from it.
Speaker 1:But you know we we have to do what's true to our hearts and and that's where I'm finding some positivity in that- yeah, you and I talked about how this time of year is really hard for a lot of the black sheep, and I did reach back out to this individual and asked if they wanted to talk to us individually. They could if they wanted to come on. This is somebody else and when I read the story it's like my heart dropped into my stomach. I can't imagine this and it's, you know, like you and I. We can't imagine some of these things because we're not wired like that. And it's just heart wrenching. And I haven't heard back from this individual, but I just, if they're listening, please, please, reach out, because this I'm going to read this verbatim, the way that you wrote it into me. I just wanted to give this person a hug. I don't want to disrespect it and say any wrong pronouns. There were no pronouns listed. I tried to look at his profile a little bit. I know he's in the community and that's all I know. So I don't want to offend him in any way, but there's no pronouns. So he says I finally stood up to my mother about her control of ways and how she treated me and the fact that I was never going to be the son that she so desperately wanted.
Speaker 1:She looked me straight in the eyes and said if you want to be a part of this family, you need to start acting like a normal boy. I felt my heart shatter into pieces. Normal meant suppressing my feelings and who I am and conforming into her twisted version of her own reality. I couldn't believe that she would not even hear what I had to say. She would not even hear what I had to say. I told her that I love her and she said how can I love you when you're not even mentally wired right? I spent weeks second guessing myself, feeling like I was the one who was broken, not her. She got a phone call a week after that that told her that I overd, overdosed, that I couldn't do with it anymore.
Speaker 1:She walked into the hospital room and said sorry and said I thank you for trying to finally take the drama and pain out of my life, but just because you're who you are, I should have known that you were not even good enough to finish it the right way the first time. Oh my God, like I just want to say before you know, even Dana says anything about this. I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart for writing this to us, because you know, we were just talking about what the holidays do to people, not just us, but in general. I was so heartbroken, I just wanted to hug you. I just wanted to softly hug you and let you know that you're not alone. I know, I know that you feel alone. I'm so glad that you didn't successfully finish what you tried to accomplish, because you have a purpose here. And to think that that piece of crap would go in there and say something like that is just. I hope it is such an eye-opening moment for you, but I'm just, I'm really dumbfounded, I'm just shocked.
Speaker 2:I'm just shocked. Yeah, I mean, I just got chills when you read what she said. Um, I, I don't know that there's even anything to say I, if there's anybody that can defend what she said or think that it was okay, I, I, I would vehemently disagree. Um, even if you did feel that way to have the, I couldn't even. Yeah, I'm rarely stunted for words, but, yes, whoever sent that in, thank you for your bravery, thank you for sharing that, because I think that's unfortunately too often the case.
Speaker 2:The only console I can offer is that, you know, unfortunately, uh, you know, I think generational aspects in society are often ignored, like we just expect people to just be okay with newer lifestyles and newer ideas and whatever it is. Not everybody is ready for that. You know gender issues and identity issues, just like you know, some people don't understand trauma. Some people that have nice parents don't understand narcissistic parents. They don't get it. But don't let your mother's view or a million people's view of your choices in life or I would even say and forgive me, I didn't mean that offensively because there are people in my life who I love very much, who you know, do not go by the gender that they were born as. So I don't mean offense by my verbiage, but just know that you're just fine how you are and you are loved and you are exactly who you were meant to be. It's unfortunate your mother doesn't see the value and the worth and the beauty of your life, but don't let that define your worth here. Don't let that define your worth here, because what one person or a million people say, you know, I think I posted something like this recently because it's something that helps me Believe me. I've had, I've had haters. I even had a medium not that long ago tell me that I have more people on my side, on the other side, than I do here on earth, and I honestly believe that if you, if you know much about my life.
Speaker 2:But one thing that keeps me going is that people that are against you, for whatever their reason and no matter who they are, they have issues with themselves. There is something about you that irritates them, maybe because you're brave enough to live the life that you want to live and brave enough to be who you authentically are, because there's nothing that irritates people more than you being authentic. They don't like that because they don't know how to be. They don't know how to live their true passion and purpose and even accept the identity like who they feel they are inside. So they want to hate on people who do that.
Speaker 2:So F her, forgive me, I feel like I'm a little angry today. It's the holiday thing, it brings it out in me. But just F her, f everybody. Live, though. Live, please live. There is a reason to. I believe everything happens for a reason. There is a reason. It was not fulfilled. So be loud, be proud and know that we've got your back, and I'm sure that everybody listening is just we're all here for you, but you don't need to be defined by that one person. Please don't let that be the case.
Speaker 1:Yes, absolutely. Hi, dana, Hi, victoria, I finally got the nerve to write in. I wanted to tell you, dana, that I have just recently gotten your books and I'm sitting down and Victoria is right, I'm going to keep this one that you're an incredible writer and I completely resonate with your story writing. I wanted to tell you that I just found the courage to confront my own mother about the toxic behavior she has inflicted on me. In return, she says to me you've always been such a burden. I wish I had never had you. Those words shattered me and in that moment I understood that my existence had been a source of her resentment of her unfulfilled and unsuccessful life. I left the conversation feeling like a discarded object, unworthy of love or belonging. Then I realized that I'm not her and I put a smile on my face, threw my hair back and walked away like a queen.
Speaker 2:Amen, amen. I am so glad to hear that because, I mean, victoria, you have a mother like that too. Some of us didn't get the fortune of having doting, loving mothers, but yeah, I think, especially for a girl, that's one of the toughest things to accept is a mother's rejection, toughest things to accept as a mother's rejection. Yes, that is just. I call that the mother wound. It is a core wound that just it just completely debilitates your ability to just even like, have any self-esteem, any sense of self-worth, any sense of security. Even so, I am glad that you are calling yourself a queen, because I just cringe when I mean, even I used to call them oh, I'm broken, I'm damaged. No, none of us are. You are a queen and thank you for reading my books.
Speaker 2:But that's not even the issue here. It's just to praise you for, for realizing your worth and for knowing that. You know, just like the last person, that our mother's, you know, perception of us does not determine who we are, not unless we allow it to. And I, like you, victoria, I think we do what we do because I don't want somebody to be 48 years old and finally, for me, I'm 48, finally realizing you know that, oh, I was meant to be here. It's okay for me to exist and it's okay for me to not have a mother who loves me. And it doesn't mean that I'm deficient and that I'm D anything. You know that I'm okay and it's all right.
Speaker 2:And so if somebody can come to that sooner in life, god love them, because then you're just healing that much sooner, you're experiencing joy and blessings and wonderfulness and skipping and you know happy and rainbows and unicorns and all that much sooner than I was able to. But this is good stuff. This is good stuff and it's the first step. You know anytime, like I said, that anybody can finally say yes to themselves and say no to somebody else and set that damn boundary. That's the start of good stuff and that's what we love to hear. Thank you for sharing that. Yes.
Speaker 1:All right, let's see my mother. My mother has always criticized my choice of friends. So one day she decides to come over and to my apartment. My apartment actually was the basement that I was allowed to have in their home as long as I lived up to their rules. She walks downstairs when I have a bunch of my friends over in front of everyone and said oh, are these the pieces of trash that you hang out with every day? I'm sure they're as worthless as you are. Their parents must be so proud. I stood up, dusted myself off and said these are my people, these are my friends, these are my chosen family. These people lift me up. This is something you have never known how to do. I have chosen my happiness over your judgment and belittlement.
Speaker 1:The silence that followed with her was just dumbfounding. My heart raced and I was petrified of what was to come, but I felt a sense of empowerment. I am sure I could not have done this with my friends not there, but the fact that they were gave me that strength I so desperately needed to say what I have wanted to say for such a long time. I am now in the process of packing and moving the hell out. Too bad for her. I hope she has someone else that'll be there for her, because it sure as hell isn't going to be me. Amen, love it. I love that. So what your friends gave you that encouragement? The point is that you did it, you know.
Speaker 2:Yes, it might've been that they were there but they got you to do it and good for you. Good for you. And you know what, sometimes you need that push to finally. I mean I, my husband, is like that. He tolerates, tolerates, tolerates, and then one day it just it all comes erupting out. But you know what, sometimes you need that because I think that's when people are finally truthful and the most truthful, and we get so scared I don't know why. Well, I do know why. I mean for me, I was scared I'd get my ass beat or you know worse, and so you keep your mouth shut. But boy it's.
Speaker 2:I'm not trying to say for everybody to go tell somebody off, because there are people that shouldn't, because I know in my life it did not always meet nice consequences, but you know when, when you can finally speak and not be silenced, it is such a liberating moment. It is because, even if you're not heard how you want to be heard, just knowing that you did it and you could do it, it's like you, you get your power back. So that's amazing. Yeah, that's anybody who says your friends are trash again.
Speaker 2:I don't know, I say it all the time, but the judgments in this world, like why do people have to be so crappy to each other. Like, even if there is somebody unsavory that you're hanging out with, like there's better ways for a parent to approach that Not that a narcissist cares about parenting, but you know, forget what anybody says. Your friends are your friends and there's a reason they're your friends. And if they're not good friends, I think you probably know that and know why. But you have the power to choose who you hang out with too. So to hell with that Right, you know.
Speaker 1:I even want to go and say that you kind of want to stand back and say maybe she felt intimidated by the number of people Cause it doesn't say how many friends were there and it doesn't matter if it's one or two or 10, that maybe she felt, like you know, in cornered in her own way, and then she felt, oh, I could take on my kid I do all the time I make my child miserable, but let me show off in front of their individual friends. So maybe that's another reason. But the only thing she did was make herself look worse.
Speaker 2:Well, that's what we think. But in their mind because now that I'm thinking about that I'm glad you brought that up because that was something that I mean even in my, even in my early forties, when I was still slightly in contact with my mother and stepfather they like well, all narcissists like an audience, because they think you, they don't expect you to stand up for yourself, because you've always laid down and let them, basically because you're scared of them, you're scared of what else they'll do, you've let them get away with what they've done. So they don't expect you to stand up for yourself. But they love an audience, they love looking like they have that control and that power over you.
Speaker 2:And I will take this one step further. I mean narcissism 101, we call it isolation. There's physical isolation, where they keep you from friends and family and anybody you love and care about. But there's also this other type of isolation I don't know what you would call it, but it falls in the same category where because my ex did this to me all the time that he didn't like the neighbor, he didn't like that friend of mine, he didn't want me to hang out with that person, because they don't want you to be influenced by anybody other, because that's when they lose control. So that's why your friends are trash. So I go back to your friends. Are not your friends are who you think they are. You know your friends. She just didn't want you to be influenced by anyone else. That's my, but you're right, they do love an audience. They love because they want you to react and for you to look like the ass.
Speaker 1:But yeah, that's their metaphor stage. That's their metaphorical stage where they come on and they're like I can't have these people around my kid because I need my kid to be alone and feel like they need me and depend on me so I can make people believe that they did this horrific things. But I can't do that if there's more people putting the truth in my kid's head. So I've got to get rid of these people.
Speaker 2:So that's probably why she came down there.
Speaker 1:It was shady.
Speaker 2:So a hundred percent. So yeah, see, we just had to talk it out, we figured it out.
Speaker 1:All right, the dueling twins? Yes, the dueling twins. I have one for you. Put your thinking caps on, because here's one for you to ponder on. This was actually the top of her little story.
Speaker 1:I chose to cut ties with my family. It was probably something I should have done a long time before, but I realized that it was time for me to focus on me and it was time for me to heal. I decided to tell them that I was leaving their life. Their angry responses stung, yet I expected them, but I knew deep down in my heart it was the right choice. I did truly feel the pain of the separation, but within that pain I discovered I had a newborn freedom. I was finally prioritizing my own well-being. This was something I wish I had done decades ago. I recently found out that my mother has breast cancer. I did send my deepest regards in a letter or card that stated I hope nothing but the best and I hope she gets well soon. She told everybody that it was the stress of my departure that caused her cancer. Everybody that it was the stress of my departure that caused her cancer.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's typical narcissism, though it doesn't matter what it is, they always make it about them and they're always the victim, and you are always the villain in their story, and you know that it's so. You know what this reminds me of. I don't know, victoria, if you've read this book or if anyone out there has read this book. One of my, one of my favorites is I'm glad my mother died, by Jeanette McCurdy.
Speaker 1:Yes, I have it on my bookshelf.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, because she, she just gives, gives it out exactly how it is. It's not nice, people are offended by the title, but the reality is there are mothers that just they're overbearing and and oh, it's just exhausting. But that's what that reminds me of and it brings the question like this is something that I get asked a lot and I'm sure you've had this question too. I'm surprised somebody hasn't written in with this, unless they haven't. We haven't gotten to it.
Speaker 2:But where a parent actually dies, a narcissistic parent, and you know, do I go to the funeral, do I not? I always say do what you, what your gut says, without thinking about it. Your immediate response, yes or no. There's no such thing as maybe in my book, maybe as just a, I don't know. But you do know, whatever your immediate feeling is, you go with it and F anyone who shames you for that are guilty. Oh, that's your mother, that's your yeah, but we didn't have that relationship just because somebody has a title in my life, doesn't you know? I even argue, even like, for example, use myself as an example, just to leave everyone else out. In my former marriage yes, legally, he was my husband, that was his title. Myself as an example, just to leave everyone else out, in my former marriage, yes, legally he was my husband, that was his title. But he was, no, not, not a husband to me at all. He was a criminal. He was a lot of things. I mean, I use the a word, that's, that's what was always in my phone for him.
Speaker 2:But you know, we just all have our different family dynamics. Even in the family dynamics we all, you know, we've talked about it before where your brother has a good relationship with mom, you don't. My brother, you know from my mother and stepfather, oh, he just thinks he has the best parents ever. I think I had the worst parents ever, totally different dynamic. So we, as self-aware people, need to separate that and acknowledge that and forget what everyone else thinks should be, because there's a lot of things that should be. A parent should love their fricking children, but sometimes they don't. So I think this is a phenomenal idea for people to think about for themselves. Because, okay, mom has cancer, but you know, I, I I'm not trying to be a Debbie Downer, but depending what stage she's in, you know, it's only a matter of time Eventually. You know, I almost said hopefully that's terrible. No, it's not.
Speaker 1:It's not terrible.
Speaker 2:That was a Freudian slip, I think I was thinking in my head, so I apologize for that if it offended anyone. But we have to think about these things because there are going to be times when these people that have caused us all this trauma in our life are going to pass and we are going to be expected because we're the daughter, we're the whoever that we have to be there. No, I don't. I mean I'm not planning on going to my mother's or my stepfather's. I have no relationship with them. I have actually packed. They still live seven miles away and I'm not allowed anywhere near their house. Like they have cameras up or anything. I can't see grandma. But I have passed by them out, like I know you've seen your, you know egg donor, sperm donor, and they same as me. Like it's like passing by a stranger at walmart. So why would I go to a stranger from walmart's funeral? Like I'm sorry you're dead, like I don't wish anybody any ill, but I mean I'm gonna be more of the jeanette mccur. Like I'm glad my mother died.
Speaker 1:Like you know we would get blamed if anything happened wrong at the service, like it would be our fault that the dirt was slightly wet or you know, whatever the case may be, and and you know I go back to people ask me all the time would you go to your parents' funeral? Well, first of all, I know I'm not going to be invited and second of all, you know, part of me always thought, okay, what if I got that phone call that said your bio dad needed a kidney, or your bio, you know, and that seems so out to lunch, like so left field? But Faith was in complete organ failure, not even a year ago, and I was literally in the process of going through. What do I need to do to donate my kidney or give her a part of my whatever she needed? And they knew about it.
Speaker 1:And it wasn't even a phone call, it wasn't a conversation, it wasn't a text message, it wasn't. Oh my God, let's put the BS to the side. This is still my biological granddaughter who is fighting for her life on life support coding daily and on multi-organ failure. And not even a text message, not even a phone call, not a word. And so you know that's kind of you know, like yeah, I get what you're saying.
Speaker 2:We find ourselves in all these predicaments, but I think that we all have to honor what we feel is truly right and I think the biggest thing about it is probably like, would you regret not going? And again, for me, my mother and stepfather are estranged, so I don't wish them badly, but I don't have any feelings for them at all. I'm even at the point where I don't even hate them. They're disgraceful. I know I'm the disgrace and difficult and whatever, and I'm the crazy one. Whatever, they can say what they want, but like, it's just not even a thing for me. So I, but I don't feel like I have to be there, but I, yeah, of course there's going to be. You know cause I'm with you. I don't get to.
Speaker 2:You know, when my grandma was in the hospital with COVID a year or two ago, nobody called to tell me, even though she has COPD and diabetes and everyone, everything else wrong with her and could have realistically died.
Speaker 2:You know I wasn't invited to her 80th birthday party, you know a handful of years back, and I probably won't even get a phone call when she dies. And what are you going to do? But it goes back to narcissists making everything about them, and they have trained the people around them all their flying monkeys, because there are so many people that just cannot conceive that anybody can be that manipulative and that vile and that cruel, that oh, it must be you, just like they said, because nobody can be that way, especially not this person that's so wonderful and charitable and all this other crap they portrayed everybody else that it is going to come back on you. But you have to get to the point where you're just okay with you. Know, I have had such. I have. I have been through four narcissists smearing my name and spreading lies about me. I mean, at this point I hear the rumor I used to get upset and feel like I have to defend. Now I'm just like I want to play into them.
Speaker 2:You know I, oh, I'm pregnant, I'm going to get a baby bump and go start. You know, smoking a cigarette and carrying a bottle Like this is what I do, Like I just start screwing around with it. But I'm not going to let anyone shame me, because I know what's what and and I'm not going to be guilted into feeling or being made to believe that I need to feel a different way. So that's my two cents on that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, All right, let's end it with a question, okay, because I'm never going to get to these questions. So you see my desk. It's like crazy. I know she sees me flipping through all these pages. Crazy, I love it. How do you reconcile the resentment you might feel towards the golden child with the understanding that they are also the product of the exact same environment you came from?
Speaker 2:Well, here's, here's the kicker on this. Love the question. Dr Gabor Mate if I'm saying his name right, if anybody has listened to him or read his books he had an interesting viewpoint on that. He said that we are not all raised by the same parents. It doesn't matter how many children two people have, but every child is born to a different set of parents because each parent, just as each human, is at a different age. There's different financial, economic changes that you might not have this much money For me. My mother was 17 when I was born. She didn't have crap. When my brother was born, well, she was married to his father and they were well-established and they had a few bucks and were building their little empire and their company totally different situation Didn't have all the stresses and things that they had, you know, because they were more financially comfortable with my brother. But even aside from the economics, mentally people go through different things in life. So you get the drift that I I I agree with what Dr Gabor Mate says is that we are each born to different parents, you know, and there's something to birth order and everything else. But the reality and I've said this a million times too but just because you are born to somebody does not mean they are going to like you or your.
Speaker 2:Even cats rejects their kittens Sometimes. You know, I had a barn cat this is so off the subject. I'm sorry about my tangents, but she was the sweetest thing in the world. Everybody that came to our farm just absolutely loved our cat nut. But my God, she'd have kittens and just leave them to die. She wouldn't even lead us to them. She was like the worst mother ever and we had another cat that would try to save them and let them feed on her and take over.
Speaker 2:But our nut, sweet, oh, she would cuddle with you and love on you, sweetest thing, but hated her. She just didn't want. She didn't want babies. So it's a tough one. I think people are like that too. You're going to like some of your kids and sometimes not others. I mean there are days that you know I love my son, but sometimes I love my stepson that much more. I didn't even have him. I always tell him he's my favorite. He causes me no stress and I have no stretch marks from him. So, yeah, I mean I just think we have to take out these expectations. I think it goes back to something we said about you know, that I said about a previous question is just should things be a certain way?
Speaker 1:Yeah, in an ideal world they should, but sometimes they're not're not, you know and because we are unfiltered, I can say this you can't help whose vagina you came out of. Maybe you could choose who you go into. I'm just saying michael just walked in the room and I think he just there's. How how much do you think is right here? This is can like. This is like. Look at this.
Speaker 1:These are the pages of questions that we have not gotten to or stories that we have not gotten to share yet. We will get to them, I promise.
Speaker 2:We'll get to them. Yeah, we'll get to them.
Speaker 1:We're working hard on it, we are, we're getting there, but I want to thank everybody for writing in, especially every person who takes the time to write in. I am going to keep hounding and finding out if my new friend has read the message or will respond back about the overdose, and we just hope and pray that you will reach back out to us again and you know we will keep tackling these and we are here for you and we love that you're reaching out to us both and telling us your stories and how we can help and we just want to thank you both, or thank everybody, and I thank you.
Speaker 2:Well, and I thank you too, and I think everybody also that that writes in again, we love hearing the good stories, the bravery, the courage you're getting from knowing that you're not alone and knowing that we all get it to some extent or another. And we love the questions. And, yeah, we all have that golden child sibling. And just don't hate on them. It's not their fault that your parents are that way and some of us have those mothers and well, you know, you feel how you feel about her and it's valid, and sometimes it's the father, both of them. But you know, just remember, we together, us black sheep, us scapegoats, we'll stick together. We are family. We are our own family that we have created. So don't let the pressures of society and other people telling you what you should feel get to you. Just know that we're here and we'll give it to you straight. So keep coming back.
Speaker 1:Yes, all right, we'll talk to you guys next time.
