A Contagious Smile Podcast
A Contagious Smile is a powerful platform dedicated to uplifting and empowering special needs families and survivors of domestic violence. Through heartfelt stories, we shine a light on the journeys of extraordinary individuals who have overcome unimaginable challenges. Their triumphs serve as a testament to resilience and strength, inspiring others to rediscover their own inner light. Each episode features candid interviews with survivors, advocates, and experts who provide valuable resources and insights to support those on their own paths to healing and empowerment. Join us as we celebrate the power of resilience, the beauty of shared stories, and the unstoppable spirit of those who turn adversity into hope. Let us guide you in rekindling your spirit, because every smile tells a story of courage and transformation.
A Contagious Smile Podcast
F-Bombs and Family Feuds: Navigating Narcissistic Parent Dynamics, Embracing Resilience, and Finding Support TRIGGER WARNING
What if the F-word was your secret weapon against a narcissistic parent? Join me and my sister, Dr. Victoria, as we share a raw and humorous exploration of our journey surviving a toxic family environment. Together, we unpack the unique language of resilience, where colorful expressions became our shield and solace against the harsh realities of growing up with a narcissistic mother. We also introduce the quirky community of Daughters of Toxic Mothers, offering a glimpse into the healing humor that binds us, with "ding dong" humorously signaling the end of a toxic chapter.
Through poignant stories, we reflect on the painful parallels between abandoned kittens and the unmet expectations of familial love. Our discussion highlights the heartache of living in the shadow of parental favoritism and the identity crises it spawns. We delve into the complex emotions around being born as a "savior child," challenging listeners to reconsider the compassion and empathy needed to navigate these intricate dynamics. The episode offers a compassionate exploration of how familial roles, like the golden child and scapegoat, shape sibling relationships and self-worth.
In the final chapters, we focus on finding strength and support from unexpected places. Personal stories of emancipation and the pursuit of self-identity reveal the resilience required to overcome the scars of narcissistic abuse. We celebrate the hidden networks of allies ready to support us, highlighting the significance of setting boundaries and recognizing one's worth beyond external validation. The episode closes with a hopeful message: within the chaos of family dynamics, there is always room for empathy, understanding, and the potential for healing and reconciliation.
Oh, good morning, Good afternoon, good evening, wherever you are, it is Dana Diaz with my beautiful redheaded twin sister, slash soul sister, dr Victoria. I always add the doctor because I don't know, I'm just so impressed with you and I love you. So we are back talking about narcissists and abuse and crappy parents who treat us like well crap and answer all your questions.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely. You know we're unfiltered, so you can't say shit.
Speaker 1:The shit hits the fan. I try not to. I have like this. I do have the ability Like I switch it on and switch it off like normal, dana, like without any worry.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm like I'll. Honestly, I'm a freaking truck driver. It's awful. And yeah, I mean, granted, I have a toxic, narcissistic mother, but one of the things she was always on me my whole life. Why do you talk like that when you have a degree in journalism? Why do you talk like that when you have all this vocabulary? You know, my nickname was the word girl because I've always loved words. I was one of those weirdo kids that would like every day open the dictionary or the source and learn a new word and use it in a sentence at some point in the day, just randomly, and people looked at me weird. But my favorite word is the F word. It is a noun, a verb, an adjective, it's whatever I want it to be at any given point in time, and it just rolls off my tongue very smoothly. It's phenomenal.
Speaker 1:But, no, I like in a, in a professional situation, like I some, somehow I can turn it off, and that every once in a while, that rare occasion it slips out when it really really honestly. Shouldn't People think it's cute or something?
Speaker 2:And I'm like.
Speaker 1:I wasn't trying to be cute. I'm pissed. I have a strong feeling. I am asserting here it's not meant to be cute.
Speaker 2:I used to get do you kiss your mother? With that mouth? And I'm like I don't kiss my mother, I don't kiss my mother, I don't have a mom. I mean, she just don't have that problem. Right, it's not a problem on this end, oh goodness, all right. So we jump in, let's go All right. So oh, by the way, our friend with the heel loves how we talk about the heel.
Speaker 1:Oh, I will never forget the heel I'm still working on. I literally have my grant, those red heels my grandma bought me, like I am just waiting for the day that I wear them so that I can make a social media post. So whoever did you know, give us this idea? Just wait, because all you're going to see is this red high heel on my foot and it has a little red satin bow right on the back.
Speaker 1:Oh it's so adorable and it's just going to say sit on it, I'll make it start twirling around. I'll animate the post. I swear to God and you'll know, everybody will know, like I've encountered like the Wicked Witch or something.
Speaker 2:That used to be my egg donor. Just ringtone. Oh my god, it was.
Speaker 1:Yeah well it's like there is a. There is a group on Facebook that I've belonged to for a while, although, I hate to say, a lot of the people are very unhealed and still very much in the victimhood mentality no judgment but it's called Daughters of Toxic Mothers and there's a thing, it's like a thing in this group. Yeah, I was going to say I thought I've seen your name in it, but you know. Then there's this thing that whenever somebody's toxic mother passes, you don't even say it, you just say ding dong, and we all know the witch is dead and and I it sounds terrible to other people, but they haven't experienced what we have, and it's not like we're glad, it's not like we killed them, it's not like we're wishing them dead, but that's what you stops when. When your problem is resolved, a good day, it's a good day, but yeah, that's that's.
Speaker 2:The code is ding dong you know that mine used to tell me that she was peter pan and she was going to live on forever oh god help us all and I was like I'm starting to believe that. And so one day I was, I don't know, I was like nine or ten and my grandparents god bless them and rest their soul my grandfather asked me he goes go ask her what live is backwards. And I was like what? And it's evil it is evil.
Speaker 2:I didn't know that and I'm like nine years old and I was watching the peter pan with you know, larry hagman's mom, when she she was the original peter pan and I was watching it and and she's like I'm gonna live on forever and I just looked at her. I was like what does live spelled backwards? And of course she had to write it down, because she's the epitome of a blonde, and so you know it's live, it's equal to evil.
Speaker 1:But if you think about it, see, I'm one of these weirdos that takes it and starts getting philosophical. But think about that, the word live. I've never known that. That's phenomenal, by the way. Thank you that it's evil backwards. But think about the dichotomy of that.
Speaker 1:Evil is like death and darkness and everything, and live is like light and positivity. It's, I mean, the transposition. It's crazy. I love it, which, by the way, you know when, when we, even though we write about real life, I mean hopefully everybody knows she is in her 50s and I needed an age appropriate name, but I, specifically I told my husband but that wasn't the real thing. I said because Evelyn, short for Evelyn, is evil and she is evil incarnate, literally. So that is her name in the book and I love it. I I'm so excited.
Speaker 1:But it's just a little insight, because we do have fun as authors sometimes when we write, just the way you know whether it's the meaning of a name or something like this. But yeah, I mean all narcissists. I shouldn't say that malignant narcissists are really evil. I mean cause. There are narcissists that I know and love very much and but they're not hurting anybody with their narcissism. They just have very healthy self-esteem. But we're not talking about those kinds of narcissists. We're talking about the ones that really intentionally try to cause a lot of problems me forever to name my ex and who kicked first.
Speaker 2:It was like one of the hardest things because I kept trying to say like no name was good enough and I kept trying and trying and I couldn't come up with it, and I was like I wanted a name that would put chills down your back just even hearing it, and like for me, keith or sutherland in the movie eye for an eye which, by the way, my egg donor told me to watch, which I had never seen um, I can't see keith. Or suddenly anything else. He was brilliant in that role he was.
Speaker 2:He was so brilliant so I couldn't come up with a name. And I tried and tried and I went through everything. So I came up with damien for his name, because when you hear it you're like you know, oh when I hear it, I think of the omen, because I'm a generation x and that was like six, six, six on his head and he's
Speaker 1:like, killed everybody and, yeah, evil little boy. That's interesting. It's funny because that is what we do we search for that name. That's just right. Yeah, now, when I wrote gasping Air, I was looking for a name for my ex and so this is actually kind of funny. So in the book his name is Darren, but it was actually a mistake. I my recollection. I was thinking to name him after. Remember the old show I Dream of Jeannie the master. To me it was like the master, yep, whatever you wish, master, okay, master, because yes, exactly, I can't do the nose thing. But that's what, to me, being married to a narcissist was, was being subservient to the master, and I don't know why in my head. So I screwed it up with the other show Bewitched In my head. I thought I dream of Jeannie, that Darren was the master. So after the book was published and after I named my ex Darren, I realized I don't know how I came upon it. I'm like Darren was bewitched. I said it wasn't so Little screw up, but oh well.
Speaker 1:At least I have a story to tell now.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 1:But yeah, Damien tops all of it Honestly.
Speaker 2:Yeah, anyway, okay, so we have the approval game where the black sheep who wrote in said I've always been the one seeking the approval and yet it never has come.
Speaker 2:My sibling they didn't have to do anything. They were always just adored. They didn't literally do anything and they were always adored Sat on the couch, ate their food, didn't have a job, yet adored. It felt as if they were giving everything to this person, who was my sibling, without even asking, while I had to beg for literal scraps. The unfairness is unbearable and I don't understand why we have to end up being the ones hurt. Good point.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I agree. But if this person is actually looking for understanding, there's nothing to understand except for this, and it's not what people normally want to hear. And it's interesting I, literally, right before we came on, I was saying the same exact thing to somebody else who was wanting to know why their mother treats you know the siblings better than they treat her, treats you know the siblings better than they treat her. And the answer is this because biology does not have any correlation to your social relationship with somebody. And, yes, being your mother, being your father, being a son, daughter any familial relationship is a social relationship. Daughter, any familial relationship is a social relationship. Your blood relation does not say your mother's going to love you, and that's a crappy thing for people. It's a hard pill to swallow, but that is essentially what we go through healing for for decades and years to basically come to the acceptance. But, like I told this person just a short time before, even mother cats I lived in the country now for many years, but mother cats every once in a while I had one cat, sweetest cat, loved everybody, friendliest thing. But gosh darn, every time she had a litter she would completely reject them and leave those babies to die? I never could understand it, because she is literally the sweetest cat ever. But you know what. This is what I try to tell people. You have a right to decide who you want to associate with and who you don't. Is it right that your mother doesn't want to have a relationship with you or wants to treat you like crap and treat your other siblings? You know differently. Yeah, it is. It sucks, believe me. We you and I have both been there, victoria. We're still there, yeah, but but that is life. And once we take the focus off of that and stop expecting somebody to be something they don't want to be, it's just like I used to have women work for me that would say, oh you know, my baby daddy doesn't want anything to do with it. It sucks, it's awful. I would still take him to court and make him financially responsible for his child, but aside from that, you cannot make somebody. If you want to make somebody be something that they're not, it is not going to end well. It is not going to end well. It is not going to end well. So I say be glad. Be glad that this person doesn't fake how they feel for you. Be glad that they have shown you how they feel about you so that you can go find somebody who does. Because let me tell you, I don't know why, but like, once I stopped worrying about, oh, my mother doesn't love me and I don't mean to mock because I have cried for many years over it and ended up in fetal position in the closet like days in bed. But once I stopped focusing on that, then all these other people were like shit, I wish I see there it goes, it slips I. You know these other people are like I'll be your mother, I'll be, I would adopt you in a second, even though you're 40 some years old. Like, there's all these people who want to be my mother and you know are willingly in my life and are not obligated. So we need to just start accepting that.
Speaker 1:Come on in, doug. Okay, we're recording. You're on a podcast. Say hi to victoria. Say hi to the millions of people listening to you. Say hi, okay, sorry, he is. He is leaving me. To go to what auto zone or something? To get a filter for my car. That's what a loving husband does. I told him I'm him, I'm a girl and I don't know about cars, so he's put it up on the lift to make sure it's running right. So I'm safe because he loves me, or he's cutting the brake lines, one would never know. But we'll find out. I love you. See you in a few. Well, that was Doug's first appearance. We've seen enough of Michael. So Well, that was Doug's first appearance. We've seen enough of Michael.
Speaker 2:So it was about time. That's probably my favorite brother in all the picture.
Speaker 1:All right.
Speaker 2:This makes my heart. So I just want to say this person did say I could say their name, and their name is Stacy. And I just want to tell you, stacy, that I want to throw you a birthday party. I just do. I just, I just want to throw you a birthday party. I just do. I just, I just want to throw you a birthday party just because you need one. So she writes and says my entire childhood was filled with absolute silent suffering. I know most of us black sheep go through silent suffering. I'm trying to tell you mine was different. My parents had a way of making me feel so invisible unless I did something wrong, and then I was the center of attention Only when I made mistakes. Check this out my first birthday that I recall. I was four, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve. You see where I'm going with this. All had birthday parties on my birthday. However, they weren't for me, they were for my sister. No, we aren't twins. No, we don't share the same birthday.
Speaker 2:But my parents gave her a birthday party on my birthday and called it her unbirthday party to celebrate my sister on her unbirthday and, as her friends would come over, I wasn't even allowed to attend the party that really should be mine. No judgment here in parentheses, but the fact of the matter is, the presents would come, the cake would come and I would be sitting in my room that had no television, no radio, no, nothing. For all of those young kids who don't know what that means. There was no computer, no laptop, no tablet, no phone, no, nothing. For all of those young kids who don't know what that means. There was no computer, no laptop, no tablet, no phone, no, nothing. I was sitting in a for, again, the young ones. I was sitting in a internet free zone. I would sit there and color in my coloring books, I would write on my papers and I would just do my homework.
Speaker 2:I spent years trying to figure out why my birthday would be celebrated by my parents and my sister on my special day. I can clearly say that, now that I'm in my mid thirties, I've never had a birthday party, I've never had a birthday cake, my parents had never told me happy birthday and I never got the first present. I understand it's not about the gifts, but when you're a kid it is about the gifts. It's about understanding that you're getting older and you're getting to be with your friends and celebrate who you are and what you're all about.
Speaker 2:So I missed my little pony. I missed my Barbie parties. I missed all those fun times with my friends who, as the years went on, ended up leaving me because I was no fun, I was boring, I couldn't have playdates. The one day I decided this was enough. After spending years and years trying to understand the messages that were drilled into me, I confronted my father after all of this silence. It was agonizing, but it did feel a little liberating. I told him how he had destroyed my childhood. After this, for the first time and I refuse to apologize for existing in his shadows he told me it was because I would never amount to what my sister was. I just want to throw our birthday party.
Speaker 1:You know what it's and I understand that and I agree, I believe me again. You've, you've read my second book. So you, you know the birthday thing. I share my birthday with mother, who didn't even want me and has nothing to do with me fun stuff.
Speaker 1:But the thing about birthdays it really isn't about the presence and it's not about the parties. What it is is that it's supposed to be a day where you're made to feel special because you are in this world. The fact that you exist is enough. And for those of us who you know we're a lot of us are people who are brought into this world by parents who didn't want us or for whatever reason, after we were born, they decided we weren't what they had expected or desired, or whatever it is. So when the birthday comes and you're not made to feel special and then to go, I will say though I mean, we had one other listener that wrote in a few episodes back remember where they had a birthday party, yes, on her birthday, but her siblings would get the presents, not her. Like I, I'm just I shouldn't be amazed or shocked by anything these narcissistic parents do anymore.
Speaker 2:Like I really shouldn't I was shocked by the one who put the twin brother in jail.
Speaker 1:That one shocked me that one didn't shock me as much as this stuff To actually have a birthday party on your birthday and but not let you come, not let you have friends, and then your siblings get cake and presents, or your sibling, I mean to say I I'm literally like and you know me, I'm rarely speechless at the level of cruelty. I can't even like I thank God, thank God, I cannot grasp it. I would not do that to somebody else's child, never mind my own, my fricking God, this poor girl. And she's right. People don't understand that, are like under, probably like 40 ish. We didn't have computers, we didn't have cell phones. We had radio, if you were so lucky, a record player maybe, and you had paper and pencils and that and you had outside that's what we had for entertainment. So basically she was stuck in her room, knowing it was her birthday and basically being abandoned, rejected, isolated. I mean it's so torturous on so many disgusting levels, absolutely.
Speaker 1:I don't know what else to say.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, I feel bad and Stacey, I just want to hug you, like give you a birthday hug.
Speaker 1:And obviously we need to say you did not deserve that at all. I mean nobody. Nobody deserves that. That was so wrong on so many levels.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my parents told me I was going to be the one to save the family, but I never felt like I had a choice and a responsibility. I was born for the sole purpose of saving my sibling. My sibling suffered from cancer and needed a bone marrow transplant. My mother mother got pregnant. Here I come and I end up having to give everything I felt like I ever had or was in order to keep her alive. I felt like a part store Growing up. I didn't understand why sometimes I had more appointments than my sister. I don't understand why when she was always in the hospital, I was always in the lab or the doctor's office getting ready to have something else taken from me. I felt as if I wasn't a member of the family. I was like the local grocery store going to get what was absolutely necessary to survive.
Speaker 2:Why is it okay for parents to be able to have the opportunity to give birth to? Really, it is a human being but in their eyes, or in some eyes, feels like a local little Walmart. To go in there and say, oh, I need bone marrow please. That's on aisle four. To feel that way we can identify ourself. It's like I'm walmart on aisle four, for bone marrow breaks my heart like breaks my heart. I don't even think that's in the realm of black sheep. I think it's worse in so many ways because from day one she was told that you're here to save your sibling.
Speaker 1:You're like the salvage yard, you're like the junkyard where people go for extra parts, and it's a hard one, because I mean any of us that are and no, I'm not saying it's OK or justifying it, I'm just always that devil's advocate because I'm just thinking, ok, let me try to look at it like how her parents were looking at, but like if something happened with my son. I only have one son. Oh my God, I want to do anything I can to save him. It would not occur to me, honestly, to have a child to serve for extra parts, but if it were presented to me, I can't say. If it were my son's life on the line, I can't say I wouldn't. So in that aspect my heart goes to the parents. But for for there has to be other stuff going on to make this person feel the way they feel.
Speaker 2:Right, and I know if you had to have brought into this world.
Speaker 1:It may not always be because you were wanted. I mean, if we could all have been planned and wanted and loved before we came here, God, what a wonderful world. It would be Right. But that's not always the case. But I feel like she had to be treated like that in order to feel like that.
Speaker 2:I feel like knowing you that if you had to do this and you had a child to help your son, you would never say these things to them. And there's the difference.
Speaker 1:No, I understand the parents. That's what I'm saying, and that's what I'm saying is that I think it's the truth. There's other stuff going on to make her feel that way because, absolutely, if I were to ever have, I mean I'm done, I'm in perimenopause and God help us all, but I it's awful, I went right through that.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Lucky you, I know, and like I told you earlier, you can cut my uterus out Like I'm literally going to lay out on your kitchen table and like I'm I'm not even joking, we'll take the chance. But I, if I were to ever have done that to save my son, because he is my, I mean, he is the world rises. Yeah, he is, he is my faith, he's everything to me, always was, always will be. But I would be so grateful and I would basically bow down to this other child and make them understand how special they are. I mean, I'm getting chills. I would never, ever, it would kill me. I know it's hurting you If they ever felt that they were just.
Speaker 1:And I've never heard a story like that. And it's so funny how we, we just, we're so stuck in in what we've been through and we hear stories. But when you get this other point of view, sometimes, because we'll see stories like, oh, you know, they had another baby and it's sick, because I remember a long time ago I knew a family who did have a baby to save a child that was already with them Never occurred to me how that child would ever feel. Never occurred to me.
Speaker 1:But it would never occur to me for a parent either to make a child feel like they were the salvage yard for the family. That's really sick. So thank God I mean now we have stem cell extraction, that they can take stem cells when you're born and save you later and whatever they do, and we have all these other resources for getting those things.
Speaker 1:But that's fine, that's really I can't imagine, yeah, she just going to have to dive down deep and know that. I mean, I believe in God. I know not everybody does, but I believe that even when people don't understand why they were brought here and it doesn't there doesn't seem to be a reason. God created you and put you here for a reason. There is a purpose, and it's not just to save another life, it's not just to be somebody's punching bag or salvage yard or whatever we often feel when we're in these situations, but there is a bigger reason. But God, I will say this God bless her for, for enduring what she's had to go through and for staying with us and and I hope she knows how special she really is and that she is so much more. And the gift of life is something that too many people can give, but she is so much more than that, so much more than that.
Speaker 2:And I hope she realizes that one day when, when she wrote in, I literally had to sit back for a minute and, like, think about it and it. You know, I tried to think about it like when she was a kid who advocated for her, who, you know what if she got sick? You know what if she got sick? Because not only that, but I think of everything that faith has gone through, and I think of, like, what, what if she got sick? And what is it doing to her body that they're constantly going in and taking stuff from her right? Like you know, she said that they did bone marrow. I don't know if you know how they take bone marrow, but it is that's an extensive.
Speaker 2:I've never seen it, but I've read about it and it is quite extensive right, but they literally go into your hip and pull it and it's excruciating, I mean. And to do this is for I don't care if you're an adult, a child, whatever, but I was reading this and I was like as a kid who advocated for her. You know what, if she gets to a point where she's like, I don't want to do it anymore, you know, I, I'm tired of being that scrapyard and who's going to advocate for me? And then you have no one to advocate for you. And then did she ever get to the point where she's like, if I don't do it and I stand my ground, you know, am I at blame for this?
Speaker 2:If something happens, or you know, and what toll is it taking on her body? Because every time you, you know, you take an aspirin, it stays in your hair for 30 days or whatever. So I mean think of everything this poor girl's gone through and I mean think of her growing up, her self-esteem. You know, to me the way that that I got from this is like her parents kept her almost in a bubble where, you know, she couldn't get hurt or she couldn't go out and play and she couldn't do these things because if she did something that could have hurt her. It could have messed up something that they could have needed. On all four Right.
Speaker 1:Or, god forbid she did get sick and there was a procedure coming up or it infected, exactly Affected some part of her that was needed later. I mean, I'm just imagining, like trying to live a normal life. Like a boy asked me out I'm 16 years old. Can I go to a movie with him? No, you can't, because your sister's having surgery tomorrow and you're giving your bone marrow or whatever, like it's so restrictive. Can I play volleyball on the school team? No, you can't, because if you get hurt, you know it's just all these different things. Or maybe this was she even allowed to go to school Because, my God, the things you pick up at school, the virus, you get a cold.
Speaker 2:Your immune system what?
Speaker 1:if you do get sick, exactly Like was she kept at home. But you know what's sad is. You know you talk about advocating who is advocating for her. I mean, I felt that same way when I was a kid. Who was advocating for me? Because even child services yeah, they did an investigation. What investigation? You asked a couple of neighbors if my mom and stepdad were nice and if they abused me. I mean what you asked my parents, employees, if they were nice and if they'd ever seen. You think they're going to answer you honestly, even if they wanted to tell you the truth. Of course not. Oh, she's fine, she can go home. No, she's not going home. And then you know, I'll know where. Ain't working for me. I have. I'm suddenly self-empowered and I'm choosing to live my life and I'm out of here. Kids can't do that to emancipate themselves either.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but emancipating is such a problem and good freaking luck with that I even had. I had people that were willing and wanting to take me to take guardianship, that were willing and wanting to take me To take guardianship Guess what Required mom's signature and mom wasn't letting that shit happen. So you know, it really sucks and we also have to look at the realization, like I always call to attention 1994. Which, yes, people say 1994. It was a long time ago, but it wasn't that long ago, it was in all of our lifetimes.
Speaker 1:I was in college in 1994 when the Violence Against Women's Act came out. Until that point, the kids she couldn't even take care of herself. Half the time the kids were left to fend for themselves. So it's a problem, but I'm glad that we now have platforms and even things like this where we can talk about it and I just hope that people understand, no matter what their relation to the story is or what's resonating that it. This does not have to do with you and people do these things or make choices. It's not always about you and it doesn't have to mean anything about who you are as a human being, unless you decide to make it mean something about you as a human being, so please remember that right and you're absolutely spot on Right.
Speaker 2:When I read your first book I was like and even in your second book it kind of resonated over that you didn't have anybody really advocating for you, not just even when you were young, I mean, even when you got a little bit older, you still didn't have that advocation for you know, helping you and and it's, it's tough and like my heart broke. Like I told you, I've read the book many times and I go back and read it again and it's harder for me because I know you and love you and I have to put it down and I'm just like, damn, I want to go have a word with so-and-so and so-and-so and but see, you're proving.
Speaker 1:This is my point, though, kind of going back to one of the first questions, is that's the thing I didn't have have any. I mean, my grandma loved me, but what the hell was my grandma going to do Beat?
Speaker 1:up my husband like seriously and she was out of state, like I couldn't like go stay with her, like she was far away out of state. But I look at now that I'm out, look at all the people I have never felt so loved and so supportive in my entire life. But it took so much healing for me to stop focusing on those people in that situation and stop withdrawing that I now have. I mean, you know, I love you to death and I think everybody knows that because we're all always loving on each other. But I have, but literally I cannot believe now, like, like I know, every day when I wake up I have an army of people out there that have my back, whether they read the book and messaged me and said I want to kick everybody's ass that has ever done anything to you, or people that are just being introduced in my life as podcast hosts, or I interviewed them, or I met them at a book signing or whatever. That we're just like we clicked and we're friends.
Speaker 1:Now, like we all. There are people out there for everybody, so nobody is ever really alone. We just think we're alone, but but we're not and there are. There are others, there are people like us. We're out there. We're like aliens. You know like we're there. You may not know it, but we got us. We're out there. We're like aliens. You know like we're there. You may not know it, but we got you. We're watching, we're listening and we bring birthday cake.
Speaker 1:And we bring birthday cake, and we have parties and we celebrate everything. And I'm dying to go to a party to wear my red heels, just so I could say, sit on it and spin. I'm just saying yes, all right.
Speaker 2:So we haven't read a lot of questions lately, so I could say sit on it and spin. I'm just saying, all right, so we haven't read a lot of questions lately. So I thought I'd pull some of the questions back out. Okay, okay. How could they look at me in their eyes and lie every day of my life, knowing I was struggling with not only their truth but my own, because they don't care with not only their?
Speaker 1:truth, but my own.
Speaker 2:Because they don't care.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I don't mean to be so blunt, but that's what it is.
Speaker 2:I said to Dana before we recorded. We were talking about something off air and it's like you know. But, like I said to her, I said I just need to hear it, Like, and she was telling me something and I said I needed to hear that from you, because sometimes hearing it from yourself is one thing, but hearing it from someone that you can trust and you love is is different. You need to hear that. So you know, 100, I agree with her. It's it's they don't care and it's not that they don't care about you. They don't care in general.
Speaker 1:It's not just you, I mean well it, I'm gonna go out there and be bold. They may not just not care about her. I mean, let's be real well I, I'm gonna stand here and say my mother could give two shits about me right.
Speaker 2:Is she like doug?
Speaker 1:hell if I know, I don't, I could honestly couldn't even tell you the last time I saw her. But all I'm saying is that people have that right and and it's I'm not saying it is right, but like one of the things that I had to learn in my healing journey and that I was forced to. It was forced on me and I resisted, but it's. The truth is that that's, that's their right. Every human being has the right to decide whatever they want for their lives and they have the right not to give a crap about you, even if you came out of their womb, even if they're your sibling, even if they're your whoever. They have that right.
Speaker 1:And it sucks, but I again, I say it many times, I just said it, but it doesn't mean anything about you because you know what. That's just the way of the world. You walk into a room of people you don't know you might meet a hundred people that you're being polite and it's fine, and certain people you're just like I don't know what it is, but like not my vibe and other people you might meet and you just, you know, like with you, victoria, we met, we like instantly clicked. Those are your people. You're not going to click with everybody and it just sucks. That's too often, apparently, all of us here just don't click with people that we're biologically related to. But it's blood, it's biology, right. It is not life determining life, altering stuff, other people have your blood type.
Speaker 2:Go find them in case you get into a situation, so that you don't have to go having babies that serve as salvage yards and I'm not making fun of anyone, but you know, go find your people. Yeah, Not always who you're related to. I've always wanted to ask my parents how could they criticize me for all of my mistakes while they never held themselves accountable for any of theirs? That's a great question. That really is a good question and it came from a young teenager.
Speaker 1:OK, so she's new to this stuff.
Speaker 2:So I think she's just realizing. So I think she's probably just realizing yeah, what a narcissist is, but that's very self-aware.
Speaker 1:But that is a signature trait of malignant narcissism is that they can't. Their ego literally cannot even think to take accountability for something, because that would mean that they are. It would mean they're deficient in some way. They're not smart enough, they don't know enough, they're not aware. It would mean that they are. It would mean they're deficient in some way. They're not smart enough, they don't know enough, they're not aware. It would mean some deficiency. Their ego can't stand. They need to think they're superior to everybody.
Speaker 1:So that is why. That is why and it's also a lot of the time jealousy and I hate to say a parent can be jealous of one of their children 100 hundred percent. So sometimes it is jealousy, because jealous people that's what they do. I mean that I know a little too much about that jealous friend, my god, turned narcissist. Uh, we've all had one of those that you find out that these people are not happy for your successes. They don't want to see you win, they don't want to see you achieve anything because they didn't and they don't like that and they become that movie.
Speaker 1:Single white female yeah, oh yeah, I had one too, okay, okay all right.
Speaker 2:Why do they try to break us down at every turn, just to build themselves up?
Speaker 1:same thing. It's just to build themselves up. They have to feel superior. It's why people, it's why kids bully other kids, it's why adults bully other adults, it's why that jackass at work has always have the better idea and be one up on you and steal your stuff, and it's why. It's why everything they have to be better and that sometimes, you know what, sometimes you want to be snarky and tell them and you got that one liner that just knocks them back down. But I'm at the point where, you know, I told my husband we were talking about one of these people this morning and I just said, you know what, let them, let me roll out the red carpet and think they're so magnificent I karma will do its thing. I'm just. I can't stand when people do that. But if they got to win, they got to win, they got to be better.
Speaker 2:This question is for both you and Miss Dana. Hi, I love the show. Thanks for all that you do. I know it's not always easy, but I had a question. How did the two of you feel when you watch the golden child in each of your lives get put on a pedestal, as you were continued to get gaslit and having to be thinking that everything was done on your expense and at your fault?
Speaker 1:on your fault well, it doesn't feel good. No, I mean that the last time that that happened, it was a two and a half years ago, when the golden child got married insisted that I take my husband and my son to spain from to Spain like Madrid, spain for him to marry his fiance, who is from there, which is not cheap and it's not easy, by the way, to do all that but went over there and being ignored, completely ignored, like I don't exist. You know that whole thing. And it's like, okay, why, why am I here? Then I have to endure my mother suddenly, years it's been years since she's talked to me, even, or that I've even seen them. They live seven miles away from me, by the way, and I had to see them across the damn ocean. Okay, I had to go to Europe to see them. And she says, oh, the bride's grandma wants to meet you. She didn't know I had a daughter. Of course she didn't.
Speaker 1:But all of a sudden, you know, here I am, I follow my mother and, oh, this is my daughter, dana, and you know my mother, who hasn't talked to me in how long, acting like she's suddenly my mother and to put on the show. But you know what this woman was in her 80s and she couldn't even stand up and she was very frail and it was my brother's new wife and it's at his wedding. I'm not going to start crap. I was very gracious and had a very nice, you know, little chat with this woman and nothing else from my mother after that and then, beyond that, I had to endure, you know, at the reception, my stepfather standing up there with my mother saying how proud he is of their son, and then he always has to throw in it. You cannot have a conversation with them without walking away, knowing that my brother has a doctorate in physics and that he's brilliant and his wife does too. So I mean, narcissistic parents love to brag about crap. And at that I very discreetly snuck away. My husband followed me and, mind you, this is an outdoor wedding in the mountains of Spain, but I'm not going to lie. So if it makes whoever's wrote that and feel better, I am 40 some years old.
Speaker 1:I had a tantrum that, like a two-year-old toddler would have Like. I literally started like throwing crap, like and stomping. I even took my shoes off and threw them and F this and F that and F them, and I'm crying all over and God love. My husband just went and collected my phone and my shoes. Just let me have my moments out in the desert. And then I collected myself after I cried in his arms and wiped tears, put my shoes back on, looked at my phone, made sure the screen wasn't cracked. We went back in. But I think that it was a healthy thing that we suppress our anger. We try to be polite.
Speaker 1:We endure, we tolerate, but you get to the point where, honestly, I think it's healthy sometimes to just let it out and let it be what it is, because you have a right to feel how you feel. But that's my last memory of having to deal with that and that's how I dealt with it, and I don't know what about you.
Speaker 2:I was always in the shadows of him and it was just always like, oh, you wrote a book where he wrote a paper, and it's harder to write a thesis than it is to write a paper, you know.
Speaker 2:Okay, yeah, I'm not taking away for a minute that it was a challenge to write a thesis, but I never had my egg donor check my work. You know, he would do work and have her check it and she wasn't the smartest crayon in the box. Um, so it was. It was always like, oh, you know, and I remember going to her and saying I'm having a really hard time with this part of the book and I and I think I put that text in our I believe I did in the narc narc and I was like you know, would you come up and just help me for a minute? No, no, I mean. And it was like but I'm trying to go through this, no, no, and here's the kicker that a lot of people don't know Both of my egg and sperm donor, you know, had involvement very high up in law enforcement and I actually asked what would you do?
Speaker 2:I asked my sperm donor what would you do if somebody came to you and said I was sexually assaulted and violently attacked and, you know, are you going to tell me, deserve it. And he never answered me. I mean, I guess, because whoever sat down at the desk and said I was violently attacked wasn't their kid, you know? Oh, and they didn't put that person in their life, they put him in mine. So it's, it's really hard, because those who don't, I guess they say teach, but that's not always true, um, but it was literally like you know the phone calls where he got in trouble for texting her while he was waiting tables and a donor runs over to the deli to go have words with the manager who's younger than my brother, and it, it's just, you know, here is a man who's younger than my brother, and it's just, you know, here is a man who's beating me half to death and you turn a blind eye and have nothing to do with me. But then you get all fired up that your son messaged you while he's at work and he got trouble for it, and you drive an hour plus out there to have words with his boss, and you know what a night and day difference. But that's the way it was growing up.
Speaker 2:Um, we were always kept very far apart, never wanting to be near each other. Um, I looked at things like you've got to be kidding, like you couldn't make this stuff up. If he came over to get the dog, um, in their 10 000 square foot house he would message her, the egg donor, and say I'm here, tell her to give me the dog. And I'm like we're in the same house, dude, yell. No, he would always go through his mom and I didn't blame him for that. It was her she manipulated him to that point. You know, and I've never had anything bad to say about him, even though he thinks different, because what he's been told. But you know, he just got married and I wish nothing but the best for him and his new husband and I didn't get to go to the wedding and in fact I don't think he might know, I know or not, I don't know, but I wish him nothing but happiness. But you're always, I always lived in the shadow of him and it was always.
Speaker 2:He always could do no wrong, no matter what it was, it didn't matter. You know, he get a car accident and it was his fault and he did nothing wrong, like you know. I think the one that really got me is. He went flying past me on the interstate one day and Faith was behind me and she was taking pictures in her phone when we got stuck in traffic and she was taking pictures and so she went to her grandma and said he was flying by us and he said he wasn't. Well, she's showing pictures and you could see me driving and you could see him in the left lane ahead, on the left up ahead, and she's like well, he said he didn't do it, he didn't do it. Here's a picture. How? How are you gonna say that it didn't happen?
Speaker 1:well, it just sounds like my mother, yeah, but you know what that's literally my mother like? Things would literally happen like two freaking feet from her. I didn't hear anything, I didn't see anything and I realized that it took me until my adult life to realize. I think that was her way of protecting herself, because she knew there were consequences for her if she participated in any acknowledgement of the bad behavior. Because that you do not want to. Well, people do call a narcissist out, but if you are a victim of them, it is sometimes dangerous for you to call a narcissist out. They will become violent sometimes. I'm not saying all of them, or there are, there is something. So I think our mothers in a way, where they needed to gaslight themselves and gaslight us, because that was their way of saying I have nothing to do with this, I am not participating in calling him out.
Speaker 2:I have cussed out your mom so many times. In that have I said some things about your mother.
Speaker 1:Well, I don't want to say I appreciate that, but you know what the thing is. And I want to say this because actually this goes along. I just want to add one more thing to our answer to this person because I think it applies to everybody that's listening. I think the key is and it resonated with me when you were saying like I wish my brother well, my brother also drank the Kool-Aid.
Speaker 1:My golden child brother Doesn't really communicate with me, but it is not his fault that he was born into a narcissistic family system. So I don't want to harbor any ill feelings towards him, just like you don't want to harbor any towards yours. They are, even if they don't realize that they are, actually victims in all of this too. So my newer, as you know, I recently found something out about my brother and his wife that I was actually it's a major life thing and I was not informed. I was not part of the family announcement because he doesn't have anything to do with me.
Speaker 1:But then something happened to change that life altering thing, which is also life altering, and I just felt very necessary to address it.
Speaker 1:But I had to be very careful not to be like, wow, I, I know, you didn't even tell me in the first place, but you know cause I didn't want to go there. But you know there was a loss involved and I just you know I did send him a message because I don't even know where he lives to have his address to send a letter or a card. You know, and he was receptive, is all I'm saying and it was just saying you know what. I'm your sister, I love you. I was made aware of this and I just want you to know that I love you and whatever you know. I just kept it simple. But I think we need to be aware of that as the scapegoat and as the black sheep, that even when our golden child siblings participate in all this narcissistic crap that's done to us, some of them I'm not saying all of them, but some of them actually still have a soul and some of them, even if they don't realize how they're participating in your pain, they never chose this.
Speaker 2:No, they did not. No, you're right.
Speaker 1:So you know and I'm not saying they'll all come around or they're all, I don't think my, my brother has either, but he was receptive to my message, which it it. It at least made me happy because he didn't have to be, and and it is what it is. But just you know, we have to just be aware that we can't blame them for what our parents decided our roles were going to be in the family. The parents can go F themselves, though, though Sorry, just saying On behalf of all of us Sit on my heel.
Speaker 1:Exactly, god, we got it. Whoever that is, you need to copyright that. I mean, if Paris can, hilton can copyright it's hot or that's hot or whatever she used to say. You got to be able to copyright. Sit on my heel and spin, I. I'm just saying, and I won't do it and you won't do it, but whoever that was, please go copyright that.
Speaker 2:That's freaking phenomenal, it was how can they justify that they tried to erase my identity just to make sure that they remained in control?
Speaker 1:That's how they justify it because they needed to remain in control. That's the key to everything, and they have to erase your identity to do it, because you can't have an independent thought, you can't have an independent spirit. You can't suddenly have self-respect and self-love and walk out of there or tell them where to stick it. It's all about control.
Speaker 2:Okay, let's go to this one. How did you guys feel when you realized that they destroyed all of their trust within you and all of the love and all of the security? Because I feel I'm never going to heal from it.
Speaker 1:Well, what I have learned from it is that it wasn't so much about trusting them because I didn't trust anybody. That's the effect that has on you when you can't even trust your own mother and your own father or whoever's supposed to be taking care of you, to protect you and keep you secure and safe and or or feed you or you know god. We've had so many stories of anything. You don't trust anybody, but the the thing for me that I have an issue with it's not about trusting everybody else, it's about trusting yourself, because part of this loss of trust involves this loss of identity and you question everything because they do gaslight you, they lie to you, they spin everything and twist it and you don't even know what the hell is, what anymore Right, and in that process, you don't trust yourself. That is why, if I may go into this whole thing and I'll keep it quick, but this is why people have anxiety, this is why people are depressed, because you know stuff ain't right your body is telling you this is not uh-uh, this doesn't resonate, this isn't aligning. Uh-uh, this doesn't. This doesn't resonate, this isn't aligning. But you're doing what you think you're supposed to be doing and you're questioning everything and you don't know if you should. Should you say this? Do you feel that? Are you even feeling the right thing? Because you're not supposed to have feelings, or they're telling you you're over emotional or you know they make you crazy? Yeah, it's about trusting yourself and that is why we talk about this.
Speaker 1:I've actually been meaning to make a video on this. But we talk about healing but nobody really understands what healing is, and for me, healing a big part of it is learning to trust yourself again, figuring out who the hell you really are, without all that noise that they told you about yourself, and learning to trust your gut, because we all have one. We just don't listen to it because other people tell us that it's wrong and what we're feeling is wrong and we're just this and we're just that and think more positive and all this stuff instead, and we listen to it because we think we're the problem. We're made to feel like we're the problem, but we're not. You're just not listening to yourself. So I'm sorry I went on a rant and totally went off tangents, but I think it's applicable. But what do you think about that?
Speaker 2:I agree because you don't know, and I don't know if the person who wrote this question heard one of the previous episodes where I talked about sitting at the table by myself, because I'm okay sitting at the table by myself, but I'm never going to have black beans at the table at on the table again and no matter how you fix them, whether you put cheese on top of them or whatever else we named to put on top of them, I still don't eat black beans, no matter how you cover them.
Speaker 2:A narcissist is still a narcissist and I went many decades without realizing that I could sit at a table by myself and I can enjoy a meal without having the black bean staring at me on the table. So I just don't have them at the table anymore. So it took me forever to realize that it wasn't me and I used to run and apologize for stuff people did that I had nothing to do with, nothing to do with, and it didn't matter because it was still my fault. I mean, I guess that you know Berlin Wall was my fault too, like everything was my fault, didn't matter what it was. You know Reagan's attempted assassination, that was my fault. I mean I was still, you know, in elementary, but it doesn't matter. Still, you know everything was turned on me, no matter what, and you feel like you can't do anything right. And then you get to the point where you get an A on a test it should have been an A plus, and I know you know that where it's like 98. Well, why didn't you get 100?, you know, and it's like but then the golden child comes back with a, b and it's like, oh, I'm so proud of you, you could. And you're looking at like that's a, b, you know, I mean, hello, doesn't matter, doesn't matter, not the same. And you just feel like, is there anything that I could have done? Because, no matter what you do, you eat all your dinner. It took you too long. There's going to be something that they find to criticize you about it. Like you, you can't get up from the table till you clear your plate. Well, okay, I clear my plate. It took you too long. Why did you take that long?
Speaker 2:You know, take bigger bites and choke on it, or, you know, whatever it is, it's, you know, oh, you, you dusted the entire house, oh, but you forgot this one place in the back of the toilet that you know you didn't get.
Speaker 2:Everything else is done, but because you didn't get that one place behind the toilet, you really didn't dust the whole house even though that's not really dusting, it's cleaning and so you lied, so you're a liar, because you didn't do what you said you did, and it's just like you feel like you're your own beetle juice in your own head. Right, your head is just going round and round and round because you go above and beyond. But it's like the one how you even come up with the one tedious little thing like who the hell in their little things about cleaning behind the toilet. You know, and you're gonna pick that up, that the whole house is dusted, the trash is emptied, you know everything else is done, but I didn't get behind the toilet so I didn't do anything.
Speaker 2:I'm a liar because I said I cleaned but apparently I didn't because I didn't do everything and it's never enough. So you really, your self-esteem goes in the toilet, your self-worth goes in the toilet, your trust goes in the toilet. It's hard to trust anyone because you feel like, if your own parents are doing it, what is is the strangers going to do to you?
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:So you literally and I know we both said it you can't heal in the environment that made you sick.
Speaker 1:You can't A hundred percent.
Speaker 2:So you cannot do it.
Speaker 1:I don't understand people that think they can try to. There's no way, right.
Speaker 2:Like when you're in the hospital they wake you up every bleep an hour to vitals and I mean, how do you rest, how do you heal in a hospital but then during the day you can't get a doctor to come in. I mean, during the day, it's like you know, go city, but at night forget it because they have nothing else to do, so they're going to come in and annoy you. It's the same thing. You can't rest, you can't heal it's the same thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is exactly the same thing, but no, I mean everything you said I agree with and and it. It is it's lack of trust, but it's it's about others and it's about yourself and I think we. That's why I like to focus on ourself, because we can't control other people I can find I. That's why I hate when people ask me oh, what are the red flags? I don't care what the red flags are. I know what a narcissist looks like to me and what doesn't work for me, but I, I'm the red flag because there was a version of Dana before the people, pleasing, unhealed version of Dana that was desperate for everybody's approval, that would never say no, that would fall victim to this narcissistic crap every time, and she didn't have boundaries. But this newer version of Dana that sets boundaries my God, she would have never been with Darren and gasping for air She'd been like, oh, entitlement, have a nice day, have a nice life. Actually, don't call me again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just we. We have to. We have to work on us and protecting ourselves from, not so much from other people, but maintaining and preserving what makes it, what makes life work for us, the trust that we have in ourselves the fact that we are firm in our decisions and that we have boundaries and we know what they are and we have expectations of how people should treat us and how we deserve to be treated, because we understand our worth. And that takes a long time. It doesn't just come automatically and it doesn't come by talking to somebody every Thursday at two o'clock. There's a lot of active daily work involved but but it's possible and we're here for you. But trust, trust, trust, trust.
Speaker 2:All right, let's do one more Always lose track of time, always. Why is it that it seems like nothing bad ever happens to the narcissistic parent? No matter what happens to me, the black sheep, it always happens to me. Nothing ever happens to them. Don't get me wrong. I'm not asking for them to get hurt, but it would be nice to see something happen to them when I'm the one who always falls on and gets hurt and they don't. Why is it they never get to meet karma face to face?
Speaker 1:Well, I wouldn't say they never get to meet karma face to face. It just sounds like you're hurting and you want somebody else to hurt because misery loves company. And don't we all believe me? We all are like, oh, I can't wait for that person to pay the price for what they've done, because you're a hundred. What these people get away with and I mean the little, and I don't mean to minimize anything-threatening and involve weapons and doctors and courts yeah, they get away with pretty much all of it. The ones that don't get away with it, we see on like 48 Hours and 20-20 maybe sometimes. But even then it's like I yell at the TV when I watch these things because they'll say, oh yeah, he, he was at work and, you know, said this and that, but I didn't think he was serious and you know, nobody, nobody hears the.
Speaker 1:Look at what just happened. I'm sorry I'm getting into these like violent things, but look at just what happened to that family in Rhode Island. The woman didn't show up for her work as a paralegal in an attorney's office for 10 days. They finally called after 10 days of her not showing up for her phone. They called the police and said she hasn't shown up to work for 10 days and the police went to the house to do a wellness check and they are actually I'm getting chills because they're saying it's honestly one of the most horrific scenes that they have ever come across. You know, even in national history that it appears on christmas day the husband murdered his pregnant wife, their two children and then himself, then himself. But they still have not released the details. But they're saying gruesome is the word that keeps coming up and horrific, and the signs are always out there. The signs are always out there, and yet it happens, and and yet it happens and there's no justice for anybody. I mean, in this case he's dead, but he killed himself, probably because he knew damn well he wasn't going to get away with that. But look at all this stuff. I mean that's a very extreme case, but look at all this stuff. What has happened to you, victoria, and to me. What happened to you is much worse than what happened to me, but our lives were still on the line and and these men are walking freely and the things our parents have done to us may not have. Well, my mother did have her hands around my neck and I blacked out and was thrown downstairs and stuff. But you know, even when it's not to that extent, the things they get away with. You know, even the most recent narcissist in my life literally makes phone calls to my husband's customers. The last one he was actually at their house doing work on their house and she called there I don't even know how she even finds out where he's going and was bad mouthing him to the customer whose house he's in and she's just like what the hell was that like? But they get away with it. They get away with it.
Speaker 1:I have called the police about harassment. I have caught oh well, it sounds like a domestic situation, a family, a family situation, family. She had sent her son to our property one day and he was in my husband's work trailer it's like a big semi-trailer where he has some very expensive wood because he used to have a wood mill and everything and taking it and putting it on his trailer and my son came in and said so-and-so's, stealing a bunch of you know, does Doug know about this? Call Doug. No, doug's like no, that's my wife and this woman had her son out there stealing it. You know, and that was a thing. Call the police on that too. Well, if you want to file a report, but you know and they get away with it, they get away with it, they get away with it. So am I just going to sit back and take it? No, not any more than anyone else, but unfortunately our hands are tied because our society our criminal system.
Speaker 1:They don't recognize narcissism or any kind of abuse that a narcissist inflicts as an actual criminal, unless somebody ends up dead, basically right or assaulted yeah but even then yeah, well, my hand would be tied that hands.
Speaker 2:I don't want to get one hand tied you crack me up we have to have a joke towards at the end. Right like you gotta no buts about it oh, it's exhausting.
Speaker 1:but you know, I I want to say honestly I do appreciate everyone who's listening, not just for you listening, but for those that are um sending, sending in their stories, because I know we both know how much you question whether you should reveal the truth and expose something that has happened to you, not just because of the shame associated with your victimization, but because you know there is fear involved. I mean, I know for both of us we've been there was fear when it should be exciting to publish books, but when you're publishing books about our content, it's a little nerve wracking. You know there are consequences. Don't think we don't go without, you know responses from people that know us and some that come out of nowhere, as I've recently had. There's a lot of fear involved.
Speaker 1:So I just want to say and extend for both of us that we do appreciate that you're bringing these stories to our attention, because even for us, believe me, we think we've seen and heard everything. But, my gosh, you all keep bringing it and and but. It's helpful. We, we love having this extra point of view. And I'm just going to say one more time the girl with the birthdays we we got you, if you can honestly let us know when your birthday is, because I would like to acknowledge you and and, yeah, stacy, thank you. But yes, I would love to know when Stacy's birthday is, because I think all of us I'm pretty sure, stacy, you'll have like at least a million people being like, hey, we're all gonna like follow you and be your weird friends from you know the podcast, um, and then the gal who forgive me because I just remember my saying salvage yard, but the gal who spent her entire childhood basically, yeah, I.
Speaker 1:I just want to say one more time you are an amazing human being for giving your sibling the gift of living longer than he or she would. I think it was a sheep but, yeah, the sister would have. But, um again, I said it already, but I just feel so compelled to say it one more time you are so much more than your body and you are so much more than what your parents recognized you to be. Um, and that's it. I just I'm sorry that some of these today were really heart wrenching.
Speaker 1:They are yeah, yeah, and that's not to minimize anybody else's but we're all meant to be here and we're all good enough and we're all and I know that sounds so cliche, but let me tell you we're here for you, we got you, we love you and you're dear to us.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and every story and question that we get. It's going to take a moment, but we're going to get to it. We're going to read it. No, matter what if we've answered it before or something kind of like it before? We're still going to read it. You're going to hear your question, but just you know, be patient with us, because we got a lot.
Speaker 1:Well, be patient with us, because one of us at least talks too much, and we know who that is.
Speaker 2:But you know, that's my husband, He'll tell you.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's my husband. They'll argue about this one. Let them duke it out one day on the podcast.
Speaker 2:That could be fun.
Speaker 1:All right, folks. Well, thank you again for listening. We love you, we appreciate you, and have a wonderful day.
Speaker 2:Thanks guys.
