Mediumship Without The Movie Magic

Your gut knows things before your brain can explain them, but how do you tell the difference between real intuition and a loud imagination? We sit down with Danielle Ribbon Clumber, an LCSW trauma therapist in Utah and founder of Willow Medella Wellness, and her husband Nganga Mr. Pishu, a medicine man and practitioner, to talk about mediumship as a lived reality: confusing, validating, and sometimes isolating. With Abby jumping in as our guest co-host, the questions are curious, direct, and refreshingly human.

We dig into the hardest part of being “gifted”, not the spooky moments, but the pressure to hide, second-guess, and feel ashamed because of culture, stigma, or fear of being labelled. Danielle shares how discernment grows through pattern recognition, self-trust, and nervous system regulation, plus why sensing energy in a room can be both ordinary and powerful. Nganga brings vivid haunted house stories, from unexplained footsteps and toys activating on their own to strange lights and experiences that seem tied to the land itself.

Then we get practical. We debate Ouija boards versus spirit boards, talk about EVP (electronic voice phenomenon), and explain why tools like tarot, pendulums, and boards don’t “do” anything without the user’s energy, boundaries, and integrity. We also explore dream interpretation through a grounded lens: snake dreams, teeth dreams, house dreams, and why nightmares may be your brain trying to solve a problem, not punish you. If you’ve ever wondered whether you’re picking up something real, this conversation offers language, guardrails, and a lot of permission to trust yourself without drifting into fantasy.

Subscribe for more honest conversations, share this with a friend who loves the paranormal or psychology, and leave a review with the biggest question you still have about intuition or spirit communication.

Transcript

A New Co-Host Joins In

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Hello, everyone, and welcome to a very, very special episode of This Is What It Takes. First of all, Mike looks so much better today because he has hair. Not to mention, Mike is not with us today because of some other prior engagements. So my favorite niece, who everybody knows on a contagious smile, Abby, who pranks my husband, is besties with faith, is here to fill in the co-host chair. Thank you. You're welcome. She's so awesome. And two of my other favorite people, I'm gonna let them introduce themselves because my niece can't pronounce his name. And so I think this is gonna be fun.

SPEAKER_02 0:41

I'm Danielle Ribbon Clumber. I'm a LCSW trauma therapist here in Utah and founder and CEO of Willow Medella Wellness and my husband.

SPEAKER_05 0:55

Bonjour and Makoka and Loranine Gnanga Mr. Pisuz. Ganange Mr. Pishu is my name. And I'm actually a medicine man life coach and practitioner.

SPEAKER_00 1:10

So my niece is here. Thank you. When she's not here, I'm I'm I I love her. So I was telling her about you guys before her trip, and she was like, What? So then she was like, I just want to talk to them. I want to say hi. And I was like, okay. So then I was like, I have a better idea. And so I said, You want a co-host? And she like came out of her skin. So I'm actually gonna let her talk and ask questions just right off the bat to them, to you guys, you'll be fine. You'll be fine. She's she is so flipping smart. This girl is so, so smart. Take a deep breath. Let's let's breathe into this. I don't know. What do you see about her? What do you see about her?

SPEAKER_02 2:03

School she does okay with, but she actually's bored most of the time, and that's why she just does okay. She'd rather be doing other things.

SPEAKER_01 2:13

Yes. I read all the time in school. That's the biggest reader. I don't think I do anything else but reading. No, that's not good. It's when I'm actually handed work and told your work. But that's like half hour. Yeah. It's well, whatever. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 2:31

That's why you do okay in school because you're like my brain somewhere else.

SPEAKER_01 2:35

Yeah, I've got I've got like mid A's, like I mean they're all A's, but it's not like I try. It's just eh. If I know it, I know it. If I don't, well, I I don't. Yeah, I don't. Most of my teachers will say I'm on my Kindle reading 24-7. There is without a doubt I'm gonna say anything else about reading. Right.

SPEAKER_02 3:00

So so was that easy now to break you in?

SPEAKER_01 3:04

Uh yes.

The Hard Part Of Being Gifted

SPEAKER_01 3:10

What's one of the hardest things about being? I don't know what the correct terminology is. What's one of the hardest things about doing what you do? Yeah, what's one of the hardest things about doing what you do? Either one of you.

SPEAKER_02 3:25

Well, it depends on what you're asking because uh we wear many hats.

SPEAKER_00 3:30

These wonderful human beings are so good for you to tip your toe in with learning how to co-host podcasting.

SPEAKER_01 3:39

Not my forte.

SPEAKER_00 3:41

Okay, but join in my world, so you'll be fine for a minute.

SPEAKER_02 3:43

So the hardest thing of what? Yeah, having fun, having gifts, do being human, being a cat parent. I don't know. Doing the medium stuff, yeah. That's what she wants to know about. I thought that's I don't want to be offensive. You know, you know what? Right now, I don't think there's an offensive term for mediumship, except uh I see deaf people, yeah. I think the hardest thing is when for me was not knowing what I was seeing was in my head or made out because I have very active imagination. And many people have gifts and they're not aware of it, or they're uncomfortable because of culture, upbringing, stigma. Also the fact that you might have a mental illness because of that, I'm gonna use a big word for you, pathology, that labeling of things. And when you're hearing voices and people talking to you, I mean, you might be thinking you're going crazy and it make you feel crazy too. So it's uncomfortable. But the hardest thing is living not in your truth. And for me, I was as closeted, and when I say closeted, I was hiding my gifts, except for some family members. I was married to my first husband for 25 years, and because he didn't believe in that stuff, it was hard to be me, even though I was knowing stuff and telling stuff. It's not because I'm just smart, it's because I would get information and just be there. Plus, I have a lot of dead relatives that like to visit me at night. And that's not the hard part. It's the hard part is when you don't accept that part of yourself, and that could be with anything. So the mediumship is just an extension of myself that I was denying and not liking because I didn't feel safe to have that voice. That was for me.

Knowing What Is Real

SPEAKER_00 5:47

How did you know that it was someone trying to communicate with you and not something going on in your head when you were first learning about this amazing gift that you have?

SPEAKER_02 5:58

You know, it was actually over time because I always loved the paradigm, like the macabre. My birthday is November 11th, so it was right after Halloween. So I just oodles of it. I loved it. Plus, it was the candy, come on, as a kid, candy, candy, candy. Oh my gosh. So uh, and I got to dress up and um be somebody that I always imagined. And because I I was I'm a big book grader too back then, and I can't do it now because I do a lot of other things, but I would be walking down the street and I hear my name go, Danielle. I go, What? And I just thought I was just spacing off because I could see things, imagine things, and they were like tangible to a degree. And it wasn't until I started seeing things happen, like I would have a dream and it would play out exactly how I dropped it. And I it was kind of freaking me out a little, but also exciting. So it's like maybe there might be something. So I would start reading books, and when I was reading the books, I was like, oh, I can do that, or that sounds familiar. But it really was actually much many years later when I was in my 20s and I was having my children when I was very sensitive because I was having family members pass away and I was pregnant. I was hypersensitive to things, and tip coffee came out with second kids. And it was actually that show that made me go, oh, I really am experiencing these things. And I and the the things that the kids were struggling with, I was like, you mean that's not normal? I I mean, I I do that. I'm like, I I I just didn't have a reference. So that was why I was a closet at second medium, was because I didn't have references to go off of. What about for me? Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, yeah, sorry. So so so so it just kind of gradually and it became exciting, but it's also learning to trust yourself too. And that's the other thing that that that communication of trusting your gut and not always questioning what comes to mind because we all have a sixth sense. I mean, we can walk in a room and know somebody's had an argument without having to read the room, you can just feel it in the energy. So now it's your turn. Sorry.

Growing Up In A Haunted House

SPEAKER_05 8:29

So I actually grew up in a haunted house. So my parents decided to move us when back in 1998. It was just better for us. My dad wanted to get closer to work, he was working out in Salt Lake. My mom was just a delhygienist, and so she could go anywhere. And we were just kind of looking for a place to have this big, huge family. I'm gonna have seven kids, so I gotta have a huge family.

SPEAKER_02 9:00

He's the youngest, I'm the youngest.

SPEAKER_05 9:01

Oh wow, and so I have two older brothers that went off to the Philippines for their mission. I have one elder brother that is still working, but still working on his mission, but yet he wasn't going yet. But he had a girlfriend, and so he stayed back in California. So it was one of my older brothers, my sister, an older brother, and my mom and dad. So we all moved out to Utah in this little tiny shop.

SPEAKER_02 9:40

We say shop, it really was a shop.

SPEAKER_05 9:41

It really is a shop, it's like a it's a 24 by 24 building.

SPEAKER_02 9:46

Dirt floor, dirt floor, wow joke.

SPEAKER_05 9:49

And so we're like, wait, this is the house? Where's the house? So we had to build it. They'll only put the cement foundation in, but it was our responsibility to build the rest.

SPEAKER_02 10:06

Oh, we're like, what the crap? You're like, how does a build how does a new house become haunted?

SPEAKER_05 10:12

It was the land, it was the land.

SPEAKER_02 10:14

I was gonna ask that.

SPEAKER_05 10:17

And so weird things would happen in the house. So there'd be like knockings, people walking down, up and down the stairs. And I I've tried to um debunk it. I mean, I've done different seances, different cultures. I'm like, okay, what is this? Praise Jesus. Even had bishops come in, they're don't know, don't, don't, don't know.

SPEAKER_00 10:48

Have you ever woken up and see in the room? I've woken up and this is a good one.

SPEAKER_05 10:54

I've woken up and I've ever since I was a kid. I woke up one day, it was like one or two o'clock in the morning, and I went to go get a drink of water. And uh when I came back to my bed, now I had a bunk bed. So my brother's on top, I was on the bottom. And I put the glass on my window seal, so I have the glass there. I look out right my window, and there's I'm on the top floor, and there's the basement. Basement's down here, and there's a guy standing outside my window with the with the cat ears looking mask. I thought it was Batman. I'm gone. It really freaked me out.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

How old were you?

SPEAKER_05 11:40

Eight, nine.

SPEAKER_01 11:41

Yeah, I'm gone. I was just a kid.

SPEAKER_05 11:45

And eventually, a couple years later, back in 2017, I was looking up at the stars one day and I saw this little star. And I when you see a satellite, you know it's a satellite. But this star kept moving up and down, up and down, and it went over and left, and went over again and shot straight out in the sky. It was I was like, I had my wife like during the time, like, you need to come out here. What is that? And she's looking at the same thing. What is this star doing? This is making the star simple, and then shooting off into the sky. That was the weirdest thing. I couldn't get on my camera because it was not the best resolution. Not the best resolution back then.

SPEAKER_02 12:31

Tell them, tell them about the time you and your sister saw something, like the toys were going off.

SPEAKER_05 12:36

Oh, so that was when I was happy when I was a kid. I woke up one morning, it was about seven o'clock in the morning, and my I had a little race car remote control car. It was about this big. And that night it went off. It went off. It was not connected to anything. It went off, and I heard it scoot from one side of the floor to the rest. Like it it scooted across the floor. And like three nights later, you hear a scream coming from downstairs. Because my sister was wanting to sleep down down there in one of the bigger rooms in the basement, because the basement rooms are a little bit bigger compared to the ones upstairs. And out of the middle of the night, you hear this like a high-pitched scream coming from downstairs. And I hear dad, dad, dad running up the stairs, and he she runs into mom dad's room, and it's like, and she's crying and she's weeping, and I can't. I'm I'm I'm talking bad. I'm like, I'm already dealing with my own stuff. I'm I'm not coming out. And we'll eventually come out of our rooms, and my dad already had the bishop over. I'm like, the bishop needs to come over right now.

SPEAKER_02 14:17

Bless the house.

SPEAKER_05 14:18

Bless the house because my saw my daughter saw the devil. Like, someone was like literally standing in her room.

SPEAKER_02 14:26

Oh, that's yeah, no, thank you. But what's also cool though is I've I've slept up there and I've been asleep, and then Gungi's woken up and he starts seeing these colored lights flying above us in the basement room. And he got to tell you, I was asleep.

SPEAKER_05 14:47

So I was asleep, and sometimes you'll you'll you'll catch orbs like flying around, and they kind of look like ferry lights, and they're actually pretty cool. But it only happens, I don't know what happened. I don't know what happened on the property, except for just the a few murders and stuff. So people were buried out there.

SPEAKER_01 15:07

A few murders, just a few.

SPEAKER_05 15:09

Yeah, just a few murders. It it's paradise. It's it's it's it literally is it's called paradise. It's paradise, it's not a small town, and so only a few people got murdered out there, and because it's Indian land.

SPEAKER_02 15:23

Yeah. But one time I was sleeping a couple of years ago, yeah, and he was like trying to figure out if it was a spirit or something, and then he realized he was seeing my energy doing stuff while I was sleeping. Yeah, that's crazy.

SPEAKER_01 15:38

Are you scared?

SPEAKER_00 15:39

I'm freaking out the house. Yeah, I ain't going there. Okay, when's her birthday?

Testing Intuition With Quick Reads

SPEAKER_00 15:46

I was telling her about this talented stuff you do. When do you think her birthday is? He's really good about this. Like he's it's it's a little scary. It's not scary, it's really cool, but before you say anything, I have told him nothing except you're my niece. Okay. Nothing.

SPEAKER_05 16:05

Nothing. Okay. So think of a number between one and ten.

SPEAKER_04 16:10

Okay. Was it three? It was three.

SPEAKER_02 16:22

Uh-uh. That was the first time that came around. So you notice I got quiet is because I was trying to hold my energy, so I I let him do his work. Because we can actually bounce off each other.

SPEAKER_01 16:33

Just kind of like they would hit and interact with each other.

SPEAKER_02 16:37

Yeah. So, like birthdays. Sometimes I don't do birthdays as well, but I can have birthdays.

SPEAKER_05 16:44

It takes me a minute.

SPEAKER_02 16:46

Yeah. But you saw how quickly I picked up on things about you. And you gosh. Okay, this sounds funny, but this is how I'm seeing this. So is I saw that like this furry thing, but it's like not really a pet. Maybe it's a bag or a purse that you pet. Or it might be a pillow, but it's like sits by your hip and you like stem on it. You it's like something fuzzy, fuzzy.

SPEAKER_01 17:14

Um, I have pets that sit by my, that sit like right on me. I've got a dog, her name's Lucy. She looks like a pillow. She'll call it.

SPEAKER_02 17:22

Okay, it was like, I it's like where I couldn't tell. It's like, and so when I see it's like it's like looking through a diluted, diluted, diluted film. So I'm like making out images. It's kind of like almost like us making out a shadow.

unknown 17:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:36

But I get a little bit more color. So I was like, that's why I said something fuzzy, but it's like almost like a pillow, but not a quite like a pet.

SPEAKER_01 17:44

Yeah. She's very tight. She looks, she looks like a pillow all the time, but she'll curl up right against our hips and stuff, and she'll lay down. We just pet her, and she's super fluffy. She looks like a pillow.

SPEAKER_02 17:54

We we gotta part of the furniture. I that's what I was like going, is it a person? Like, it's like attached to you. Yeah. So so thank you for validating. And of course, we have skeptics that will say that was like fishing for information, but literally, I'm putting puzzle pieces together. Yeah, and I it was based on my references that I know that can come to me. Like, I when I say spirit, I uh things that are not from my own brain that comes to me. And it can be from any source, can be from the collective, which is we all have energy. Uh, it could be vibration, it could be from my spirit guides, it can be from your relatives, my relatives, maybe friends, maybe even I call them passerbys, people that come in and check and go or look-ules. I call them look you lose. They're like, Who what are you guys doing? Because they pick up our energy. It's actually kind of fun. But but for birthdays, sometimes I only get part of the information. He gets more information, and we just kind of put the pieces together for things. It's kind of cool.

Ouija Boards And Safer Tools

SPEAKER_01 18:55

Do are the prints Ouija boards? Did I pronounce it? Do those help you in any way, or are they more a nuance?

SPEAKER_02 19:04

Okay, you you just tagged on the best question we have her because we have different views on this. Oh debate, yay! Okay, so I don't like Ouija boards, but I'm okay for spirit boards because it's kind of a a bias. Because Ouija board is it's a brand name, and that was promoted as a game, and that has because of that, people have gotten actually hurt because there's not a way to monitor who comes through. There's like rules, and people get tricked in in open portals, not good energies come in. You can't, you're tricked, and and if you don't do right, you can actually hurt yourself or others, and you might actually make a haunting even bigger than you want to, or a place that may not have been haunted because you invited something in, comes in. So I say I don't like Ouija boards. However, this is the funny part. If you say I'm using a spirit board, my nervous system calms down because that connects more to the spiritualism movement. He had a Ouija board, he has to hide it from me. Oh no, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 20:22

So I so I grew up LDS my whole entire life, and so I met this lovely lady who has a very crooked eye and gibbid leg. It's his first wife, it's my first wife, and so she had a little bit of disability, but she was very into like a the cult, the the Lorraine and Ed Warren and just everything. So I was like, this is kind of like this is a little weird for me.

SPEAKER_02 21:02

Little did he know teaching her.

SPEAKER_05 21:06

A little bit, yeah. And over time I just kind of learned to grow with it and she got in Ouija boards, and we I end up going to more seances than she did.

SPEAKER_02 21:26

Don't punch attention when I said that. I I I knew her. Uh she's gifted gifted person, but wow, now they're using buttons that the butts coming in.

SPEAKER_05 21:38

Uh she she had some quirks that difficulty of reality. Some reality re I can't even say it. Reality and relating to reality. There we go.

SPEAKER_02 21:55

Sometimes is it becomes its own addiction and people will use the tool abuse it and that is and here's the thing a spirit board or widgie board tarot cards pendulums passing rounds they're just tools yeah they're using your energy and that's why they need your energy to touch it so it's actually an extension of you so if you are in integrity and you're just playing around with it that's how you can get I'm gonna say get burned pretty much so that's why we have different um opinions on it I mean I remember my sister being when I was a kid because the stigma of uh we divorce she made her own with a cardboard box and little colors and I used to play Dungeons Dragons and then she used my dice oh and I was so scared that she was bringing something into the house that I just was banging out of the door and she didn't realize there was a legit scare because I knew of so much negative that had happened around it not because it was cursed or anything any of those things because that's vibration too but it was really funny because I used to say my dice never rolled right because my sister cares to because she was using it the Ouija using it to communicate with the Ouija word. It was really funny and my sister and I have had conversations about this but we didn't realize that our house actually had activity I didn't grow up into a traditional whatever traditional haunted houses because I I was we I would see lights shooting through the dark at night and when you asked about gifts I was putting things together when I was in high school I found out about rods and cones in your eyes and you can't have a light source you can't see in the dark without a light source and that's why the color and I was like going I was like what the heck was I seeing I was questioned like what what's going on and it turns out I was pregnant with my third oldest well my third again I guess I actually not third oldest backwards on that uh she's 22 right now so 22 years ago I remember this conversation it was April it was a week before she was born and we're my brother and I my sister were all talking about what we'd been seeing as kids in the house and we never really talked about it. It just yeah didn't make sense I knew my youngest brother had definitely he saw a floating head of an old man and closed eyes had disappeared because I watched him running across our neighbor's yard booking out of the house when I was coming home from school I was like I knew what he saw but I didn't know what they'd seen. So my sister was seeing the same thing with the lights but with different colors so the orbs we'd all have dreams about wolves and stuff and we lived in on property that was used to be a mink farm and by canal so it was so there's a lot of activity there and just down the street was a graveyard. So I used to think this the spirits from the graveyard were coming to my house. I might have been right because they weren't ever consistent. So that's why I said passers throughs they would come in check us out and then leave they just wouldn't stay and it really was like putting the the the science to what I was experiencing and things were not adding up but yet I understood things that I couldn't understand like in junior high I understood why wave lates and light waves worked vibrationally I was hypersensitive to things and so I was like had these aha moments of that makes sense. So this is why this might be happening to me but I couldn't understand the why I was hearing my voice being called by things I couldn't see. Sometimes I would see things but no one else could see and why was I having dreams that were coming true that science didn't end up but the paranormal stuff and Lori Warren psychic mediums they that made sense and I was and I was LDS too and I was like to me it was an extension of my belief system even though they didn't promote it. I just like well but they're talking about this in scripture why can't this all be happening too I was like immersed immersing it and messing it together.

Dream Symbols And Snake Themes

SPEAKER_00 26:15

So here's a question why what does it mean I don't know if you like this is just a seat a question what does it mean when someone dreams about like a whole bunch of snakes is this something that you guys can answer like yeah actually because somebody has a dream about like an abundance of snakes you can't get rid of every time you get rid of them and move them there's more and more and more everywhere you turn there's more and more what does that mean?

SPEAKER_05 26:42

So that could come up to a it's it's kind of more of a stigma that that's kind of what I heard it's it's like a stigma like you you get like he might even have a terrifying snakes.

SPEAKER_02 27:00

A phobia a phobia there we go a phobia so there could be a phobia going on that his ancestors are coming through of that he needs to learn because eventually it might come down to he actually has to encounter a snake and then there's this other But there there's the other meaning that there could be people in his life that are snakes that would make total sense so what's cool this was my dream last night and it I had I had so I sleep I sleep I don't really sleep I had like a nap I my daughter has the world's biggest phobia of snakes but I I don't hate them I'm just not like I want one kind of thing you know like so here's here's the funny thing about snakes so I grew up with snakes they were pet snakes when I was a kid yeah it's kind of weird so you're uh Indiana Jones phobia of snakes kind of ironic so the the thing about dreams Carl Jung talked about dreams and memories and things so I was having these dreams and I I read a book from Sylvie Brown called the dream dictionary I was like going and I loved the beginning she said take what you want and leave the rest and because I was still trying to figure out my gifts and I was reading it and I found that I understood dreams more than the average person. Now I didn't study dreams but I do go if there's a theme Google it go dream what what are the themes and what aligns with you would make sense because a peach in a dream could represent something different for somebody else but sometimes a peach is just a peach. But if you have colors that are strong you may be astral traveling and having visits from relatives talking to you sometimes like I I I saw my dead friend but they were two years old when I knew him then it's like because that's that from the totem or familiar person or they'll you have people go I kissed my ex-boyfriend's brother sister or something and I why would I do that? I go it doesn't always mean that so what happens and and this is a really neat thing psychology wise when we have a nightmare our brain's actually trying to show us what it needs to know to problem solve. And the problem that why we call it a nightmare is because we get reactive and our nervous system gets ratchet especially when we had trauma and so it becomes uncomfortable and we want to get away from it. But if we can regulate our system and understand things and learn from the themes that present we actually can address the things that our brain's trying to figure out in our dream state and bring it into here. So but sometimes the snake let's do that theme maybe you're shedding maybe that you're shedding many layers and it's all happening at once and it's uncomfortable maybe you're raw and and also you can do the proverbial snake the Garden Eden story whatever that aligns to can be that story. Like one of my favorite things back then when I was reading Silver thing about I kept dreaming I was losing my teeth I couldn't and or there'd be loose teeth that's a common theme that comes in and comes out you feel like you're saying too much or or people not listening. Those are themes and I that was a big thing back then. And sometimes I'll get a loose tooth and I'll look wake up I'm like going okay what's going on I have a theme about bathrooms and or water and I it's always and I always need to go to the bathroom and it's always in a icky public stall and I can go to the bathroom public stalls but it's like that ickiness like the the they're closed down this and this and I realized bathrooms were getting cleaner and more fancy and I was like okay what is that thing that I mean because I have to deal with a lot of crap because of my profession. Yeah and sometimes you're you can't get rid of it or you're trying to move it and what you need to do is not and it was funny because I usually I wake up and I do need to go to the bathroom so there's that coincidence too. But even though I Google bathrooms that's not the theme that comes into me figuring things out. And sometimes when we dream about houses we're talking about our our bodies and what that represent I would dream about my grandparents' house. I haven't been there in years but because it was my version of home and safety that's what I I will dream about like the kitchen the the front room or or when there's a different theme I'll be at my mom's house but uh I'll be married to to Nagangay but my kids are little so those are things that look at what we do it's kind of like somebody going to school and they're naked like why would I be naked at school? Well if you had a problem with learning something you feel like you have to go back to school relearn something and you were like but I passed the first time maybe you didn't feel adequate or you're having some doubt about yourself. It's fascinating.

SPEAKER_00 32:10

It is fascinating well I like all right so she really wants to know what you read from her and this is her exciting

Reading Abby On Stories And Identity

SPEAKER_00 32:18

moment. So I'm gonna let them do their ma I mean I don't want to say magic but but you know what I mean. Like this is I love watching this because they are phenomenal.

SPEAKER_02 32:26

So I'm just gonna okay for some reason you have a pet dog we know that but you would like a thing you like the fantasy kind of mystery kind of thing I don't know I feel like you like to be the heroine without she's a dungeons and dragons kind of girl yeah oh I actually I hope when they start playing that soon my dad but I do love fantasy books and mystery and stuff. But you like to be the heroine but it's kind of the like the the the awkward heroine like the the the the person that nobody sees but then it comes goes ta-da she's the wizard yeah yeah the wizard yeah Gandalf I like that one yeah you you like to do the magic but you also like to be the rogue is the the person that's the hero but doesn't want to be the hero yes that yes would love to be but like no that's but you basically make it work pay give me pay uh make it worth my while otherwise I'm gonna actually give me something worthwhile don't make me just do it for you know saving the world like yeah but and you've been dabbling you've been dab oh my gosh you've been dabbling independently with some story themes you keep trying to write down but you keep having think you have writer's block but you keep starting it but do you've been thinking about it for a hot minute and you're like well what about this story but then you overpeak it please tell her again I did not tell you anything about her to Michael about this like yesterday.

SPEAKER_01 34:09

Okay but hold on tell her I did not tell you anything about her except I haven't talked I have not met the last mess message I got from her was are you available to do this and my niece has joined us to co-host I got the same text you are spot on spot on this is let me ask you let me ask you a question what brought on the the whole Ouija spirit board so yeah because you have a question about that well I have a little bit of a question on that I was I think I was watching I think I was watching like Sam and Colby on YouTube and with they brought a Ouija board and I researched it a bit but I didn't still like quite understand it and then and then I was looking at like energies and stuff and wondering how it affected different people with their energies.

SPEAKER_02 34:58

So I thought I would ask that that was a and I appreciate him asking you because you asked that question because this is what we do we want to educate the the correct way now we're gonna give you when we say correct way does not make us the experts this is just he's not the expert I am actually the a little bit of the expert on this stuff. But you also get your agency to have it aligned for you. Some people do do well and are safe with vegetables that even includes with doing EVBs do you know what an EVP is I think so. So those you don't know it's electric voice phenomenon so you can record something it can play back and there's now apps out there that will bring up the words it's just like anything else when you communicate with spirit or the paranormal you're gonna get stuff that will entertain you surprise you and scare you but if you treat it with respect and with dignity you can do it cleanly and it will actually help keep you from hurting yourself or others along the way because also when you think about if you're working with I'm just gonna generalize this dead people if you cross over and you and you believe in that stuff I'm not gonna say you're not or second means obviously we believe in it because we get information it's gonna happen when it happens it's gonna happen when it happens but if you treat with the a person with uh respect and dignity they may be as rescepted back to you and not be such a pain in the ass and rude and obnoxious I mean come on if you're a teenager and someone's poking at you are you gonna retaliate too obviously I I know Michael I'm like waiting if somebody's saying my husband is Danny I'll do this Danny I'll do that.

Pranks, Playfulness, And Boundaries

SPEAKER_00 36:51

My husband is Michael and then yeah so yes they poke fun at each other okay let me tell you what she did what he did he went to the airport to go get her okay oh I gotta I'm gonna text you a picture of this so you can see it. He he makes t-shirts right and he made this t-shirt that it's be on the lookout and he had a picture of her and he had a mustache and all this on her and it like he made her look like Hitler while sleeping while sleeping and then it had like the wrong description and everything on there on it and it was like be on the lookout for and he went through the Atlanta airport wearing this oh my gosh he told me the TSA people laughed well I told him leave it I'm like you're not wearing that somebody's gonna have a fake with you going to the Atlanta airport TSA and security and all that. So he says okay babe he left wearing one shirt because I watched him leave and he switched in the car. Such a teenager move this is what they do this is what they do to each other. Like she put false eyelashes on his brand new vehicle and then wrote I put fake burr poop on it too.

SPEAKER_02 38:02

Oh yeah that was nice that was fun it was kind of smelly if you both show up with I'm with stupid and you're and he wears this on I'm with dumber you're gonna be great.

SPEAKER_01 38:13

Oh we really should that would be great funny it would be so what else do you get from her because I think she is like which is great because she's never that way okay who's the friend that wants to not be in the friend zone what what I don't know there you have a friend a guy friend yeah you have a guy friend guy friend or it's a maybe a female that has a masculine energy not gonna buy be biased Mars no it's not Mars it's not she someone wants to be more than just in the friend zone I don't know on that one I have a lot of okay so so okay that I text so that's not fair because they may be still uncomfortable but do you have a friend that like wants to be with you all the time yeah I don't know we just got out of school so they really really want to hang out with you just like randomly I haven't got anything about that maybe I don't know I do I there are a couple guys that I do snap all the time so who knows I don't know he's had one of them it's it I it's it's like he has this light sandy brown hair but it could be the lighting I do know somebody with that hair color he was part of our prom group prom group how close can you work with somebody without I'm just gonna say I feel like he was we were making plans for prom and we invited him along because he knew most of us and he can't he couldn't go to prom without having a date because he was in a younger grade than us. So we were like okay and actually a friend of mine invited him because I already had I already was taking another good friend of mine with me. We were doing a friendship date thing and so he ended up coming with us to our prom lunch that we did it was like eight or of us and we were all hanging out and having fun and then we all went to prom and and stuff and I mean the two of us were kind of hanging out together and to dance with him?

SPEAKER_02 40:22

No there was no dancing that there was too you know the the funny thing about okay so pop psychology is not true psychology but I gotta say this I don't know I remember being a teenager and if I liked somebody I'm gonna I I would go on a date with somebody else just to be in their vicinity and I know or hang out. That's so true so true.

SPEAKER_01 40:47

I I don't know I'm not very so uh in all fairness it it's just very budding right now so I'm not very knowledgeable the whole relationship thing I haven't done it once or ever so I mean like I so basically you're both so both so you're both clueless how to do this probably she wouldn't have a clue if he flirted with her that he was flirting not at all oh I have people that think somebody's flirting and they've never flirted they're like they're flirting with me like because he gave attention so don't worry about it he just likes you a little bit more okay that's why I was just asking who it was because I was just pig I got a ping on my he got the ping on the only guy yeah sandy hair sandy brownish blonde hair by the way this this is it's gonna Victoria when you when she gets back home tell give us the popcorn and the tea that we were right isn't I and you know what's gonna suck now is because it's not she's aware of it she's gonna get little butterflies too she's gonna get a weird crash too I'm going to bite your finger I don't care I only have four it's five fingers that's a thumb it's thumbs don't count it's a thumb it's a thumb Abby don't you know there's the rule when you have one finger pointing at you three more pointy backs up the thumb it's giving you a thumbs up I know that was bad did you figure out her birthday yet why did November come in but not quite november because it's September September it's November I have a sister in September it is November and you will be if you would say it the not quite November I was born November 30th.

Career Talk And Creative Futures

SPEAKER_02 42:44

So like it's almost December I was born so I was right November yeah September I actually have a sister in September and a couple aunts and uncles so yeah how fast that picked up when you asked me so here's the fun thing you're not a Scorpio so that's another funny fact and there is a if anytime somebody says I signed a document on November 31st know that they're lying because there's no 31st on November yes last year no that was a it was a riddle that we had learned as a kid I always remember that I'm a November baby. Because I originally was going to ask if you were born in July or August because I heard 11 11's November yeah I am a November what does she want to do after school what do I want to do can you I know what I want to do I know what you want to do anyway did you let did you let my eye roll with that one when doesn't she want to do gosh she does want to flip pancakes nope she doesn't want to flip pancakes no I do not like cooking I can cook I just I don't like it.

SPEAKER_01 43:56

I'm not so she'd rather sit down and draw

SPEAKER_02 44:00

You actually yeah, you just want to be paid for your your gifts, which is you want to write, but that's not what you want to do. Now you want to do that for fun. But you actually are very artistic, so maybe not necessarily making a game, but like doing a like writing like a game.

SPEAKER_05 44:22

It would be more like storyline movies.

SPEAKER_02 44:24

Movies?

SPEAKER_05 44:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:25

Yeah. Okay. Like at all. So mind you, you said after school could be like her whole life.

SPEAKER_05 44:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:35

Like what kind of profession? She wanted to know if you could guess her profession that she wants to go into.

SPEAKER_02 44:39

Okay, I'm gonna tell you straight up that profession you're not doing.

SPEAKER_05 44:42

Yeah, not that.

SPEAKER_02 44:44

Like photography or you want to do that, but you're not doing that.

SPEAKER_05 44:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:51

I've been wanting to do this since I was like six. That's the problem.

SPEAKER_01 44:57

Oh no.

SPEAKER_02 44:58

The moment you make your job, you're not gonna like it.

SPEAKER_01 45:01

Yeah. Oh no.

SPEAKER_02 45:08

Oh no. Doesn't mean you won't do it. That's not your profession. Okay. I wanted to be a doctor. I thought I was gonna be a surgeon. Guess what?

SPEAKER_01 45:20

You're not a surgeon?

SPEAKER_02 45:21

I'm gonna be a doctor, not the doctor I thought I was gonna be. Oh sometimes you get close to what you want. Doesn't mean you aren't going to be doing something close to it.

SPEAKER_01 45:33

Well, I wanted to be a teacher and I thought I was gonna do high school, but then I figured out that I do not want to do high school at all. We're too chaotic.

SPEAKER_00 45:42

I'm thinking of doing like elementary, but that would be artistic in a way because you'll be using creative ways.

SPEAKER_02 45:49

Um yeah, you just okay. So remember when I said you don't want to do the papers, the writing? I know teachers, they hate that.

SPEAKER_01 46:00

Oh, I do. I don't like writing much, like for teaching stuff. I do I hate doing like lesson planning, it sucks. But I mean, it's easier with younger kids.

SPEAKER_05 46:12

Go into photography, photography, don't listen to him.

SPEAKER_02 46:15

Do whatever you want.

SPEAKER_01 46:17

My sister, actually, my older sister, she did photography for a bit. You're keeping it up on her sister.

SPEAKER_02 46:24

So professionally, you know what? Here's the thing: you can be a teacher and not teach in a school. You can actually be artistic and actually teach how to write storylines and visual board vision boards and things like that. So you are going to be more creative because you're gonna get bored. And because you don't like structure in that way, I mean, if you did want to be a teacher, you'd be not reading those books all the time, you'd be helping the teacher. You'd be volunteering, you'd be a teacher's aid.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

Sorry, just was a teacher's aide. I was. Did you like it? I liked it the first like two months, and then it just got repetitive because I was there in the beginning. Did I just say bored? Did I just say bored? Like I loved the kids. It's just it's kind of repetitive, especially with that's what G knows young. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:23

So so am I white or am I just very good at sizing people?

Gifts Versus People Skills

SPEAKER_01 47:35

They're all right.

SPEAKER_02 47:36

So that is always a question because my profession, I am a mental health therapist. I know people.

SPEAKER_01 47:43

I don't know people.

SPEAKER_02 47:45

But some of my gifts give me clues to how people respond with energy, what they do. So just because we are gifted to do things doesn't mean we can do it all. We only get pings and references. I mean, it's kind of like you getting I get I get lost driving sometimes, but I find new things in my ground. Oh, I was gonna do something. Sometimes I can't find his energy. I'm like, where the hell is he? This is driving me nuts because I know how to sense him. I know where he is, but other times, but because we're so close together, we also keep our energies to ourselves. So that's so just like reading somebody else. If somebody doesn't want you to read something, that's a no, it's not a permission slip. And so I'm not gonna look at it, but I will get other information to help. And maybe as you will somebody opens up, I might give more information on the part that they were protecting. Because sometimes it is a trauma response, and sometimes I'm not supposed to tell you because it's part of your journey from that discovery and awareness. And I shouldn't deny you that process.

SPEAKER_05 48:55

But does this am I doing I'm sorry? Hold on. Does your sister bug you about uh being a photographer then? She has photography right now just keeps blaring my ear right now.

SPEAKER_01 49:07

She does. She bugs me a lot about her, she wants to use her cameras a lot more often. So she bugs me about wanting to do things with her for it. So okay.

SPEAKER_05 49:17

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 49:17

That explains that.

SPEAKER_05 49:18

That explains that.

SPEAKER_02 49:19

See, see, see, like that's like a Mr. Peace. It's like, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 49:22

Like, why am I getting that?

SPEAKER_02 49:24

It's kind of like it's almost like being in the shower, the why wondering why that shower keeps going hot and cold, hot and cold when no one's in the house. But then you're just realizing there's air in the bubbles, and then you just all you're only getting the sensations, you're like, I'm experiencing it, and just keeps repeating like this is driving us crazy because it gives we sometimes just get the information over and over, and like and we get stuck in it too.

SPEAKER_05 49:47

Yeah, I got stuck in it. Yeah, so I had to ask.

SPEAKER_02 49:50

So, so Victoria, you were asking a question.

Am I On The Right Path

SPEAKER_02 49:53

Sorry. Am I doing what I'm supposed to do? About you. Am I doing what I'm doing?

SPEAKER_00 49:59

I always were. That was weird. I heard a no, but what are we but what question are you asking then? Yeah, what are you asking? Am I doing what I'm called to be doing? Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_05 50:10

That is in so many different levels.

SPEAKER_02 50:13

So, okay, uh let me let me clean up something. When you asked that question, I got unnause. What is making you so nauseous? What do you keep questioning if you're doing right? Because you know, you're gonna do what you have to do in alignment, but what is making you so sick to your stomach that you're like almost it's like an anxiety.

SPEAKER_00 50:36

I have to plead the fifth.

SPEAKER_05 50:40

You have the what?

SPEAKER_02 50:41

I have to plead the fifth right now. Then stop worrying about getting into trouble and just do it. You're being told. So so right now, you're so scared of doing something wrong that you're actually doing something wrong. You're blocking yourself.

SPEAKER_01 51:04

You asked right into it. I don't know what you expected.

SPEAKER_02 51:11

You asked. Do you do not let people tell you differently? You know your your your your stuff. I I I almost want to swear here. You know your crap, you know who you are, you know where you stand, don't let them minimize you. Get angry, be the mama bear, be your own mama bear, and actually step in and go, F you all, I'm doing it anyways.

SPEAKER_01 51:37

Do it.

SPEAKER_02 51:40

Wow. By the way, those books are gonna be fantastic. But but I knew about your books, though. That I'm gonna let bias on that one.

SPEAKER_00 51:52

You did wow,

Closing Thanks And What Is Next

SPEAKER_00 51:54

all right. So I'm gonna do another show with just Daniel and I here in the very near future. We're gonna actually schedule it here very soon. I want to thank uh you for co-hosting with me today.

SPEAKER_02 52:05

I didn't do much, but then but uh by the way, I I'm not telling you what to do, by the way. I was just reading the energy. I was like, what's up?

SPEAKER_01 52:11

I asked it. So it gives me something to think about. Maybe uh reevaluate kind of what I'm doing. And live with me.

SPEAKER_00 52:19

No, yes, yes, uh you think she should live with me when she graduates. You know what? Depends on which graduation.

SPEAKER_05 52:30

It's up to her.

SPEAKER_01 52:31

What which graduation? Yeah, which one? I have two plans in my future. I've got three of them actually.

SPEAKER_00 52:38

She is doing something amazing. She is starting her senior year. Okay, but she's do you remember when I told you how smart she is? She's already halfway through college.

SPEAKER_02 52:48

So you're gonna have you're gonna have a certificate. Which certificate are you getting first?

SPEAKER_01 52:52

My associates.

SPEAKER_02 52:54

Okay. So with your associates, make sure you check the prerequisites with whatever school you're going to transfer to. But if you do before your associates, if you graduate with your associates, they take all they have to take all the credits. And if they say that you have to take another class, you can say, I got I did already in the first degree.

SPEAKER_01 53:13

Yep. I have I talked with my counselor about that, and it's like everything's been working out great. So when I graduate high school, I'll graduate with my associates, and then I'll go straight into my junior year of college, graduate in like two years, and then go straight back for my master's.

SPEAKER_02 53:30

So there's a certificate that you are going to have get a paper, a recommendation that if you do it right, you'll get it actually a good. I don't know if it's a grant, but like a award, an award scholarship or something. Ask about that. Okay.

SPEAKER_05 53:46

But there's a there is a type of funding.

SPEAKER_02 53:48

There is a funding. And so there's this piece of paper that you get like no, I don't know if it's a notary or an award, but they present it to you like an award.

unknown 53:57

Huh.

SPEAKER_02 53:59

Okay. I will and and and this is one that you're gonna have to come back and tell me what it is because it it's pretty yummy, but it's a little down the road a little, but not far.

SPEAKER_01 54:08

I will definitely, I'll definitely come back.

SPEAKER_02 54:10

Look at it at about six nine, yeah. Look at it in the fall, right? Because you're gonna have to get it in before the deadline. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 54:19

Okay. Well, I want to thank everybody for tuning in and listening because this is what it takes. And I'm gonna have them back on again. Thank you guys for being here. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_03 54:29

I love having them on here.

SPEAKER_00 54:32

Thank you.